Search found 206 matches

by davidmartin
Sun Oct 20, 2019 8:54 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: In what sense Mark (Judaizer) was a disciple of Simon Peter (docet Papias): an example
Replies: 31
Views: 11031

Re: In what sense Mark (Judaizer) was a disciple of Simon Peter (docet Papias): an example

Giuseppe, I am doubtful of Jesus or anyone else on the cross saying 'why have you forsaken me'
It seems way too convenient as a psalm quote with many uses later on
Although it lends a totally docetic feel I agree, which may have been an early Christian belief in some circles
by davidmartin
Sun Oct 20, 2019 8:02 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?
Replies: 206
Views: 84535

Re: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?

I will observe for now that the final redaction of the gospel of John itself seems to have been written by somebody other than the beloved disciple, since several key texts speak of this disciple in the third person and imply that he is already dead (I am using the masculine pronouns for him becaus...
by davidmartin
Sun Oct 20, 2019 6:27 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?
Replies: 206
Views: 84535

Re: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?

Why do you date John the way you do? What does it for you? well, this is going to be unorthodox.. the gnostics talked about a female figure that generated the lower aeons. I see this as referring to an actual person and they are talking about mythologised history. there's some pointers for that. so...
by davidmartin
Sun Oct 20, 2019 5:36 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?
Replies: 206
Views: 84535

Re: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?

Papias preceded the gospel of John this doesn't necessarily contradict the dating of John to the 90's, if Papias in his youthful heyday was around that sort of time but he carried on with the traditions he received at that time. I can quite believe he didn't use John in his corner of the church but...
by davidmartin
Fri Oct 18, 2019 6:43 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?
Replies: 206
Views: 84535

Re: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?

I am also pretty sure that the Johannine epistles predate the Johannine gospel ah i wonder. well, 2 John refers to a lady, who may be entertaining the 'wrong sort' of Christians. This ties in again with a Mary/Johannine community on the fringes, but gospel-ready. 1/3 John is a different church I th...
by davidmartin
Fri Oct 18, 2019 6:10 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Was the Judaization an obstacle against the diffusion and acceptance of a gospel? NO at contrary...
Replies: 1
Views: 3638

Re: Was the Judaization an obstacle against the diffusion and acceptance of a gospel? NO at contrary...

Giuseppe you're right I think, as the OT scriptures (as opposed to a Jewish theological framework) were key to the popular Paul gospel which relied on them heavily. The form of Judaization that required following the law in all aspects (ouch) was not very popular. A proposed docetic Jesus may on pap...
by davidmartin
Fri Oct 18, 2019 5:02 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?
Replies: 206
Views: 84535

Re: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?

Y'know i agree with that Neil. It's funny how Peter always gets nunchucked by Jesus over Mary you'd think he'd learn to stop it by now :) Recently i thought about the claim the Naassenes had some connection to it. On reading the Naassene writings one is left with a strong sense of male supremacy in ...
by davidmartin
Fri Oct 18, 2019 4:08 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?
Replies: 206
Views: 84535

Re: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?

And the gospel made her male because...? Social pressure/expectation?
Because of everything. It would be saying everyone should turn round and all listen to her and accept her ruling on all matters, if she were alive at the end of the apostolic age.
by davidmartin
Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:12 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?
Replies: 206
Views: 84535

Re: 1 Clement & the Gospel of Matthew?

Dating something/anything from the Long Recension that early... wow. i knew it was coming. guess that makes me a heretic! the reason is, it fits a puzzle piece in for me. let's say this Mary is an elder, and according to Ignatius's reply she was in Rome in Linus's time Let's further say she has som...
by davidmartin
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:39 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: In what sense Mark (Judaizer) was a disciple of Simon Peter (docet Papias): an example
Replies: 31
Views: 11031

Re: In what sense Mark (Judaizer) was a disciple of Simon Peter (docet Papias): an example

That sounds like an hypothesis worth exploring. The Pauline epistles were full of theology and church praxis, but very short on details about Jesus himself. An entertaining gospel might have been just the thing. yes, kind of like an 'open goal' just waiting to be filled. Paul does have an aversion ...