Self in Theravada

What do they believe? What do you think? Talk about religion as it exists today.
iskander
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Re: Self in Theravada

Post by iskander » Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:35 am

Thank you Ananda, reading your answers helps me to understand recent history.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMWT6CB ... EQ&index=1

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Ananda
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Re: Self in Theravada

Post by Ananda » Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:45 am

iskander wrote:Thank you Ananda, reading your answers helps me to understand recent history.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMWT6CB ... EQ&index=1
LOL, good luck with that!
http://chronologia.org/en/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tDOZOW ... X9P6IrYfIe
~Oh dear! Oh dear! I shall be too late!

iskander
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Re: Self in Theravada

Post by iskander » Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:30 am

The law of kamma sends dogs to the Buddha's hell ?

Intoduction
WHAT IS kamma? Buddha said: “Oh monks, it is volition that I call kamma.”
Kamma means volition or will. When you do something, there is volition behind it, and that volition, that mental effort, is called kamma. Some people say that kamma means the cause, the deeds, and also the effects. But in Theravada Buddhism, kamma never means the effect or the result. Kamma means only the cause.

Kamma is a moral law which needs no lawgiver, a law which operates like a law of physics, a universal natural law.--- During the time of the Buddha, there lived a brahman named Todeyya. He was a very rich man, a millionaire. But he did not believe in generosity, in giving. He said, “If you give, then you become poor; so don’t give anything away.” He was so stingy that he became a millionaire, and he died a millionaire. But he was so attached to his riches that, after death, he was reborn as a dog in his own house.


One day, the Buddha went to that house, and the dog saw him and barked at him. The Budhha replied: “Oh, Todeyya! You showed disrespect when you were a human being, and now you show disrespect by barking at me. You will be reborn in hell.”
Volition
Sayadaw U Silananda

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Ananda
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Re: Self in Theravada

Post by Ananda » Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:39 am

"'Kamma should be known. The cause by which kamma comes into play should be known. The diversity in kamma should be known. The result of kamma should be known. The cessation of kamma should be known. The path of practice leading to the cessation of kamma should be known.' Thus it has been said. Why was it said?

"Intention, I tell you, is kamma. Intending, one does kamma by way of body, speech, & intellect.

"And what is the cause by which kamma comes into play? Contact...
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/stud ... html#kamma
~Oh dear! Oh dear! I shall be too late!

iskander
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Mourning and weeping in this valley of tears

Post by iskander » Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:15 am

Mourning and weeping in this valley of tears.
dukkha :
Ad te suspiramus, gementes et flentes
in hac lacrimarum valle.

Dukkha-sacca The Truth of Suffering
Firstly, by a process of reasoning: He ( Gautama)made his disciples feel that life is a struggle, life is suffering; birth is suffering; old age is suffering. Were it not for the moha (delusion) which keeps him (humanity) away from the Truth.

Freedom from Dukkha?

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Ananda
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Re: Self in Theravada

Post by Ananda » Thu Mar 23, 2017 1:50 pm

You should know the answer to that!
~Oh dear! Oh dear! I shall be too late!

iskander
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Re: Self in Theravada

Post by iskander » Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:07 pm

Ananda wrote:You should know the answer to that!
Thank you for your time, and I mean it.
But I have lost any interest in my own thread.
Have a nice time. :)

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Ananda
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Re: Self in Theravada

Post by Ananda » Fri Mar 24, 2017 2:00 am

iskander wrote:
Ananda wrote:You should know the answer to that!
Thank you for your time, and I mean it.
But I have lost any interest in my own thread.
Have a nice time. :)
Perhaps you don't know the answer to that, being specifically the third (3) Noble Truth.

The four (4) Noble Truths are an integrative whole. It's been a preoccupation in the west to not emphasize the Joy of release from dukka as well as the bliss of the jhanas.

"The Third Noble Truth says that there is a cessation of suffering; and suffering will and must cease when the cause (tanha) is eliminated. "For who is wholly free from craving there is no grief, whence fear?"

"Investigation for Insight", by Susan Elbaum Jootla. Access to Insight (Legacy Edition), 30 November 2013, http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... el301.html .


Commentary:

[B. DESCRIPTION OF THE TRUTHS]
13. [494] The “truths” next to that (XIV.32) are the Four Noble Truths; that is to
say, the noble truth of suffering, the noble truth of the origin of suffering, the
noble truth of the cessation of suffering, the noble truth of the way leading to the
cessation of suffering.
14. Herein:
(1) As to class, and (2) derivation,
(3) Division by character, et cetera,
(4) As to meaning, (5) tracing out meaning,
And likewise (6) neither less nor more,
(7) As to order, (8) as to expounding
Birth and so on, (9) knowledge’s function,
(10) As to division of the content,
(11) As to a simile, and (12) tetrad,
(13) As to void, (14) singlefold and so on,
(15) Similar and dissimilar—
Thus should be known the exposition
By those who know the teaching’s order.
Visuddhimagga CH. XVI

There could be a conflict of interest for those content are less likely to do that adventure you call in America, "Shop until you drop" which sounds exhaustive.

Or in Sutta:

"Monks, do not wage wordy warfare, saying: 'You don't understand this Dhamma and discipline, I understand this Dhamma and discipline'; 'How could you understand it? You have fallen into wrong practices: I have the right practice'; 'You have said afterwards what you should have said first, and you have said first what you should have said afterwards';[1] 'What I say is consistent, what you say isn't'; 'What you have thought out for so long is entirely reversed'; 'Your statement is refuted'; 'You are talking rubbish!'; 'You are in the wrong'; 'Get out of that if you can!'

"Why should you not do this? Such talk, monks, is not related to the goal, it is not fundamental to the holy life, does not conduce to disenchantment, dispassion, cessation, tranquillity, higher knowledge, enlightenment or to Nibbana. When you have discussions, monks, you should discuss Suffering, the Arising of Suffering, its Cessation, and the Path that leads to its Cessation. Why is that? Because such talk is related to the goal... it conduces to disenchantment... to Nibbana. This is the task you must accomplish."

Notes

1.
"You are putting the cart before the horse!"

"Viggahika Sutta: Wordy Warfare" (SN 56.9), translated from the Pali by Maurice O'Connell Walshe. Access to Insight (Legacy Edition), 30 November 2013, http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .wlsh.html .

Returning home to, "Self in Theravada" a wholesome self is cultivated, a right self, a harmonious self, leading onward to emancipation.
~Oh dear! Oh dear! I shall be too late!

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Ananda
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Re: Self in Theravada

Post by Ananda » Fri Mar 24, 2017 4:29 pm

Dear iskander,

Thanks for your most direct post!

May the rabbit of time, O never mind.lol
~Oh dear! Oh dear! I shall be too late!

iskander
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Re: Self in Theravada

Post by iskander » Sat Mar 25, 2017 3:30 am

Ananda wrote:Dear iskander,

Thanks for your most direct post!

May the rabbit of time, O never mind.lol
You wrote this:
“Buddhism is always a question of knowing and seeing and not that of believing. The teaching of the Buddha is qualified as Ehi-Passiko, inviting you to come and see, but not to come and believe.”

Ven. Dr. W. Rahula, 'What the Buddha Taught'
http://www.buddhanet.net/budintel/buddhism/comesee.htm
~Oh dear! Oh dear! I shall be too late!"



How am I to reply to this?

I suggested the sending of a dog to hell requires believing it was possible to do that , Gautama is as dependent on faith as much as the resurrection of Jesus is.

As I read Theravada the message I get is the overriding importance of meditation to acquire the what to know; a blind and lonely activity whose fruits are obscure.


I do not want to imitate Muslims and Inquisitors . and interfere with the search for wisdom which is the goal of Eastern religions according to Gnostic Bishop---- in another thread.

:thumbup:

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