question about evil

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Gnostic Bishop
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Re: question about evil

Post by Gnostic Bishop » Tue Dec 18, 2018 10:47 am

moses wrote:
Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:56 am
i have a philosophical question

some christians believe that God is not the creator of evil .They believe that God allows evil , but does not create it.

Wouldn't this mean that God is not maximally perfect in his power and control ? And wouldn't this mean that non-God things(evil) are able to come into existence magically without needing God to cause them?

How did evil pop into existence in the garden if God did not create it?


God seems to be like a being who is not absolute.
In the beginning, so believers think, there was only God.

All that exists then must have emanated from or been created by God.

This logic is irrefutable.

Regards
DL

bbyrd009
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Re: question about evil

Post by bbyrd009 » Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:32 am

It isn't even disputed, one may even find where God will let you eat your children if you make the choices that take you there, and those were "believers!"

The pov of an evil God is the same one as a teenager who proclaims that they hate their parents imo. We even have a Discourse for this, along the lines of "well, if you think I am so evil, hadn't you better shut up and get busier?" and etc. You can only fool yourself with this imo

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Re: question about evil

Post by Gnostic Bishop » Tue Jan 29, 2019 1:49 pm

bbyrd009 wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:32 am
It isn't even disputed, one may even find where God will let you eat your children if you make the choices that take you there, and those were "believers!"

The pov of an evil God is the same one as a teenager who proclaims that they hate their parents imo. We even have a Discourse for this, along the lines of "well, if you think I am so evil, hadn't you better shut up and get busier?" and etc. You can only fool yourself with this imo
How many children have a genocidal son murdering parent? If they do, is the children proclaiming their parent evil not the right thing to do? Or do you not think that genocide and infanticide are evil traits?

I pulled this from your other post.

"How did evil pop into existence in the garden if God did not create it?"

What evil? I do not see it and neither do the Jews who see Eden as where man was elevated.

Christians did change that more intelligent view to an evil fall but then stupidly sing that Adam's sin was a happy fault and necessary to God's plan. Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?

If evil was in Eden, it had to be God who put it there.

Regards
DL

bbyrd009
Posts: 107
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2018 10:52 am

Re: question about evil

Post by bbyrd009 » Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:21 am

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 1:49 pm
bbyrd009 wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:32 am
It isn't even disputed, one may even find where God will let you eat your children if you make the choices that take you there, and those were "believers!"

The pov of an evil God is the same one as a teenager who proclaims that they hate their parents imo. We even have a Discourse for this, along the lines of "well, if you think I am so evil, hadn't you better shut up and get busier?" and etc. You can only fool yourself with this imo
How many children have a genocidal son murdering parent? If they do, is the children proclaiming their parent evil not the right thing to do? Or do you not think that genocide and infanticide are evil traits?

I pulled this from your other post.

"How did evil pop into existence in the garden if God did not create it?"

What evil? I do not see it and neither do the Jews who see Eden as where man was elevated.

Christians did change that more intelligent view to an evil fall but then stupidly sing that Adam's sin was a happy fault and necessary to God's plan. Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?

If evil was in Eden, it had to be God who put it there.

Regards
DL
ha, good points, i find absolutely no "Fall" in Scripture as is so often advertised, except as a human perspective, myself.
As to "Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?" i would say categorically "yes," bc making gold involves removing impurities, or making gods with free will involves "weeding out" the gods with impure intent, perhaps

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Gnostic Bishop
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Re: question about evil

Post by Gnostic Bishop » Fri Feb 01, 2019 2:04 pm

bbyrd009 wrote:
Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:21 am
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 1:49 pm
bbyrd009 wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:32 am
It isn't even disputed, one may even find where God will let you eat your children if you make the choices that take you there, and those were "believers!"

The pov of an evil God is the same one as a teenager who proclaims that they hate their parents imo. We even have a Discourse for this, along the lines of "well, if you think I am so evil, hadn't you better shut up and get busier?" and etc. You can only fool yourself with this imo
How many children have a genocidal son murdering parent? If they do, is the children proclaiming their parent evil not the right thing to do? Or do you not think that genocide and infanticide are evil traits?

I pulled this from your other post.

"How did evil pop into existence in the garden if God did not create it?"

What evil? I do not see it and neither do the Jews who see Eden as where man was elevated.

Christians did change that more intelligent view to an evil fall but then stupidly sing that Adam's sin was a happy fault and necessary to God's plan. Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?

If evil was in Eden, it had to be God who put it there.

Regards
DL
ha, good points, i find absolutely no "Fall" in Scripture as is so often advertised, except as a human perspective, myself.
As to "Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?" i would say categorically "yes," bc making gold involves removing impurities, or making gods with free will involves "weeding out" the gods with impure intent, perhaps
Not a bad analogy, but the process of gold purification cannot happen without heat, and you are saying that heat is evil without acknowledging that it is's evil is overshadowed by the good purified gold it produces.

Like our own evolution, we must both cooperate/do good, and compete/do evil, to evolve, and that is why I say that competition is just a small part of the greater good of continuing our evolution.

Regards
DL

bbyrd009
Posts: 107
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2018 10:52 am

Re: question about evil

Post by bbyrd009 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:11 pm

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 2:04 pm
bbyrd009 wrote:
Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:21 am
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 1:49 pm
bbyrd009 wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:32 am
It isn't even disputed, one may even find where God will let you eat your children if you make the choices that take you there, and those were "believers!"

The pov of an evil God is the same one as a teenager who proclaims that they hate their parents imo. We even have a Discourse for this, along the lines of "well, if you think I am so evil, hadn't you better shut up and get busier?" and etc. You can only fool yourself with this imo
How many children have a genocidal son murdering parent? If they do, is the children proclaiming their parent evil not the right thing to do? Or do you not think that genocide and infanticide are evil traits?

I pulled this from your other post.

"How did evil pop into existence in the garden if God did not create it?"

What evil? I do not see it and neither do the Jews who see Eden as where man was elevated.

Christians did change that more intelligent view to an evil fall but then stupidly sing that Adam's sin was a happy fault and necessary to God's plan. Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?

If evil was in Eden, it had to be God who put it there.

Regards
DL
ha, good points, i find absolutely no "Fall" in Scripture as is so often advertised, except as a human perspective, myself.
As to "Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?" i would say categorically "yes," bc making gold involves removing impurities, or making gods with free will involves "weeding out" the gods with impure intent, perhaps
Not a bad analogy, but the process of gold purification cannot happen without heat, and you are saying that heat is evil without acknowledging that it is's evil is overshadowed by the good purified gold it produces.

Like our own evolution, we must both cooperate/do good, and compete/do evil, to evolve, and that is why I say that competition is just a small part of the greater good of continuing our evolution.

Regards
DL
then in that case you will employ the Hegelian or "satan's" dialectic, an implied winner and loser, and also read Scripture from that pov, when it was surely written from the Naive or Eastern dialectic, imo. Competition as a model to be outgrown iow, an actual changing of the mind, implied in many ways i guess hate your life hate your family etc

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Re: question about evil

Post by Gnostic Bishop » Sat Mar 30, 2019 12:06 pm

bbyrd009 wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:11 pm
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 2:04 pm
bbyrd009 wrote:
Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:21 am
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 1:49 pm
bbyrd009 wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 8:32 am
How many children have a genocidal son murdering parent? If they do, is the children proclaiming their parent evil not the right thing to do? Or do you not think that genocide and infanticide are evil traits?

I pulled this from your other post.

"How did evil pop into existence in the garden if God did not create it?"

What evil? I do not see it and neither do the Jews who see Eden as where man was elevated.

Christians did change that more intelligent view to an evil fall but then stupidly sing that Adam's sin was a happy fault and necessary to God's plan. Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?

If evil was in Eden, it had to be God who put it there.

Regards
DL
ha, good points, i find absolutely no "Fall" in Scripture as is so often advertised, except as a human perspective, myself.
As to "Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?" i would say categorically "yes," bc making gold involves removing impurities, or making gods with free will involves "weeding out" the gods with impure intent, perhaps
Not a bad analogy, but the process of gold purification cannot happen without heat, and you are saying that heat is evil without acknowledging that it is's evil is overshadowed by the good purified gold it produces.

Like our own evolution, we must both cooperate/do good, and compete/do evil, to evolve, and that is why I say that competition is just a small part of the greater good of continuing our evolution.

Regards
DL
then in that case you will employ the Hegelian or "satan's" dialectic, an implied winner and loser, and also read Scripture from that pov, when it was surely written from the Naive or Eastern dialectic, imo. Competition as a model to be outgrown iow, an actual changing of the mind, implied in many ways i guess hate your life hate your family etc
To outgrow competing, in the natural world where we all live, is to go extinct.

Regards
DL

bbyrd009
Posts: 107
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2018 10:52 am

Re: question about evil

Post by bbyrd009 » Thu Apr 04, 2019 11:02 am

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Sat Mar 30, 2019 12:06 pm
bbyrd009 wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:11 pm
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 2:04 pm
bbyrd009 wrote:
Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:21 am
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
Tue Jan 29, 2019 1:49 pm


How many children have a genocidal son murdering parent? If they do, is the children proclaiming their parent evil not the right thing to do? Or do you not think that genocide and infanticide are evil traits?

I pulled this from your other post.

"How did evil pop into existence in the garden if God did not create it?"

What evil? I do not see it and neither do the Jews who see Eden as where man was elevated.

Christians did change that more intelligent view to an evil fall but then stupidly sing that Adam's sin was a happy fault and necessary to God's plan. Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?

If evil was in Eden, it had to be God who put it there.

Regards
DL
ha, good points, i find absolutely no "Fall" in Scripture as is so often advertised, except as a human perspective, myself.
As to "Are you suggesting that something necessary for God's great plan is somehow evil?" i would say categorically "yes," bc making gold involves removing impurities, or making gods with free will involves "weeding out" the gods with impure intent, perhaps
Not a bad analogy, but the process of gold purification cannot happen without heat, and you are saying that heat is evil without acknowledging that it is's evil is overshadowed by the good purified gold it produces.

Like our own evolution, we must both cooperate/do good, and compete/do evil, to evolve, and that is why I say that competition is just a small part of the greater good of continuing our evolution.

Regards
DL
then in that case you will employ the Hegelian or "satan's" dialectic, an implied winner and loser, and also read Scripture from that pov, when it was surely written from the Naive or Eastern dialectic, imo. Competition as a model to be outgrown iow, an actual changing of the mind, implied in many ways i guess hate your life hate your family etc
To outgrow competing, in the natural world where we all live, is to go extinct.

Regards
DL
im sure that is the consuming fear at least, yes

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Gnostic Bishop
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Re: question about evil

Post by Gnostic Bishop » Fri Apr 05, 2019 4:57 pm

bbyrd009 wrote:
Thu Apr 04, 2019 11:02 am
[To outgrow competing, in the natural world where we all live, is to go extinct.

Regards
DL
im sure that is the consuming fear at least, yes
[/quote]

I do not see it as a consuming fear. I do not welcome death, yet, but do not fear it.

I just see what I put an evolution as a fact.

Regards
DL

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