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An opinion regarding Islam

Discussion about the Quran, hadith, the history of Islam, etc.

Re: An opinion regarding Islam

Postby JPCusickSr » Sun Mar 19, 2017 2:51 pm

outhouse wrote:First nothing is holy, it is considered holy by some.

Being considered as holy by some is quite enough for me to give it my respectful due.

outhouse wrote:In historical context the term is called TEXT not scripture or divine or holy. That is not an academic understanding, TEXT is.

In this case the terminology of "holy" is emotional and provocative and much more fun than being academic, and so is scripture and Divine.

Religion for me is very enjoyable, even when it is trying and difficult then religious application is usually a fun adventure - IMO.

I concede that being academic can be enjoyable too ~ if a person has that kind of an attitude.

outhouse wrote:NEXT, why would a god have to copy mythology and fiction and tell others factual fiction was real ?

God can use anything to reach out to ignorant humans, but none of that means that God would ever truly lie.

Fake stories like Superman and Batman and Harry Potter and King Arthur and etc etc, are all fictional stories which inspire people to a better perspective.

Many people demand that the story of Adam and Eve were factually real, while they completely miss the hard hitting message which that story delivers to me.

I do not blame God for what ignorant people do or believe.
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Re: An opinion regarding Islam

Postby outhouse » Sun Mar 19, 2017 3:54 pm

JPCusickSr wrote:Being considered as holy by some is quite enough for me to give it my respectful due.
.

In a historical sense we only deal with text

so is scripture and Divine.


No, scripture is said to be divinely inspired.

But it factually remains unsubstantiated, and all research points to mans hands only.

but none of that means that God would ever truly lie.


If you believe in divine inspiration, then you have to also believe the god was literally stupid and repeated and sold fictional myths, as real events MOST theist believe as real events.

Events which you understand have no historical basis.

The whole term Abrahamic faith is telling because Abraham is a fictional character who factually never existed. And it was obvious the self proclaimed prophets in islam believed these were literal events.

Try getting any muslim to accept the true Israelite history even the factual aspects, is impossible.
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Re: An opinion regarding Islam

Postby JPCusickSr » Sun Mar 19, 2017 5:39 pm

outhouse wrote:In a historical sense we only deal with text

That would be leaving out the better parts, and I will never go along with that restriction.

Sourcing only bland and dull history is not for me.

outhouse wrote:
If you believe in divine inspiration, then you have to also believe the god was literally stupid and repeated and sold fictional myths, as real events MOST theist believe as real events.

I reject what most Theist claim.

Technically ~ literally stupid fictional myths are not really lies.

And speaking in metaphors use to be very common for human language, and still today people do love a clever metaphor.

outhouse wrote:Events which you understand have no historical basis.

I will give you the credit that many people feel that way - but I do not.

When I go to any scriptures then I do not look for any historical basis.

Even if (if) Jesus or Muhammad did not ever exist - their words of wisdom certainly do live onward.

outhouse wrote:The whole term Abrahamic faith is telling because Abraham is a fictional character who factually never existed. And it was obvious the self proclaimed prophets in islam believed these were literal events.

No one knows if there was a real Abraham or not, but the message given through that name is the important part of the story.

It is told that Abraham put an end to human sacrifice by obeying God, so who cares if the name or person is real when the human sacrifices stopped?

Priorities sir: Genesis 22:10-14

outhouse wrote:Try getting any muslim to accept the true Israelite history even the factual aspects, is impossible.

[ Repeat statement = Repeat response: ]
The Muslims and the Jews are far more open to such things then are the Christians.

If it were allowed then I would be burned at the stake by all three of the Abrahamic faiths.

The real question here is if you can accept what I say on your own terms, as like I have on my own terms.

I do not need the Muslims to agree with me just as I do not need any Christian or anyone to agree with me, or any of them to use as a reference.

My faith stands all alone - otherwise known as - a personal relationship with God.

Personal relationship mean one-n-one and not a group relationship as in a church or religious group.

I embrace all religions and philosophies, but do not belong to any.

Thereby I am the ultimate infidel.
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Re: An opinion regarding Islam

Postby outhouse » Tue Mar 21, 2017 10:19 am

JPCusickSr wrote:
That would be leaving out the better parts, and I will never go along with that restriction.

.



Not up for debate, in an academic setting it is text not scripture
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Re: An opinion regarding Islam

Postby outhouse » Tue Mar 21, 2017 10:26 am

JPCusickSr wrote:When I go to any scriptures then I do not look for any historical basis.

.


To me that is missing the complete beauty of the text. As an atheist I often see more beauty then any theist because I understand why and where the text came from, and the true inspiration which factually is 100% human inspired showing the true beauty of humanity which does not need to rely on some made of divinity.

All these authors were doing was describing their thoughts and feeling and emotions in the ONLY terms they knew. Aristotelean prose and myths that had no idea were not real due to their ignorance of the natural world around them. These are epic pieces and the text is not the problem of fanaticism, it factually is the ignorance of theist who attribute their imagination to said text, and have no context of moderation.
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Re: An opinion regarding Islam

Postby iskander » Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:31 am

iskander wrote:Timeline: The Ottomans and the Balkans
Chronology :
1300s:
Turkic tribe known as Ottomans forms small state in western Anatolia.

1352:
Ottomans invade and begin to occupy Bulgaria.

1371:
Ottomans defeat Serbs and their allies at Battle of Maritsa.

1389:
Ottomans inflict second defeat on Serbs, now led by Prince Lazar, at the Battle of Kosovo, beginning slow conquest of Serbia.

1402:
Ottomans move their capital from Asia Minor to Edirne (Adrianople) in Europe, signaling their intention to become a major European power.

1453:
Ottomans encircle and conquer Constantinople, ending the Byzantine Empire.

1459:
Fall of Smederevo liquidates last remnant of independent Serbian state.

1463:
Ottomans almost complete conquest of Bosnia, executing last king of Bosnia, Stjepan Tomasevic, at Jajce.

1468:
Albanian warrior prince Skenderbeg dies. Within a decade of his death, Ottomans overrun most of Albania.

1493:
Croatian nobility annihilated at Battle of Krbava in Lika, opening way to Ottoman conquest of much of Croatia.

1526:
Hungarian army crushed at Battle of Mohacs, opening way for Ottoman conquest of Hungary.

1557:
Sultan decrees restoration of Serbian Orthodox Patriarchate, vacant since the 1460s. Return of Patriarchs to Pec stimulates revival of Serbian identity within Ottoman Empire.

1683-1699:
Habsburgs conquer Ottoman-ruled Hungary and Croatia, forging new frontier between “Austrian” and “Turkish” empires. Failed uprising among Serbs in Kosovo results in mass emigration of Serbs to Habsburg Slavonia and Vojvodina.

http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/article ... -in-europe


Later on, during the conquest of the Balkans, the Turks, with the religious sanction of the grand mufti, took as tribute from the Christian population a percentage of the male children. These became the "slaves" of the sultan. Completely severed from their Christian families, these children were brought up as Moslems and imbued with religious devotion to Islam and loyalty to the sultan.
http://www.theottomans.org/english/camp ... ndex_3.asp
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