Re: Fernando Bermejo-Rubio
Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2024 3:00 pm
I have suggested that 100 years after the death of the last Hasmonean was not a major historical turning-point.
You change the subject.
You change the subject.
Ye olde BC&H forum of IIDB lives on...
https://earlywritings.com/forum/
I did not respond to that post as I think it's for Jewish historians to make a judgement on their own history.....and what history they chose to remember as being relevant.StephenGoranson wrote: ↑Sat Mar 09, 2024 3:00 pm I have suggested that 100 years after the death of the last Hasmonean was not a major historical turning-point.
You change the subject.
David - I am simply using historical dates (as historians supply them). That's all...If there are periods of time - 63 b.c. to 37 c.e - i.e. 100 years between two dates of historical interest - then - I find it interesting what both Philo and Josephus have assigned to the end date. Again, with 37 b.c. and 63 c.e. - what has Josephus done with 63 c.e......DCHindley wrote: ↑Sun Mar 10, 2024 1:36 am But mh, while English monarchs might celebrate the 100th anniversary of something as a "jubilee year" is kind of new.
I am not aware of any time division system in use then (in Judea), that used any other system than 7 year blocks of years or multiples (7x7=49 for sabbatical years, sometimes 49th or sometimes 50th year is designated the celebrated Jubilee year). There is the Jubilee time counting cycle of 49 years, and a celebration of the "Jubilee year" either same as the 49th year or sometimes as the 50th year (the first yr of the next 49 year cycle).
If you want to find significance in 2 jubilee cycles (100 yrs using two jubilee cycles plus their celebratory years, which would be weird as they were normally not added to the 49 year cycles but celebrated concurrently), as opposed to a jubilee cycle (49 yrs & multiples of 49), I suppose that is fine, but I have to think it sounds a bit arbitrary.
Can you supply any cases to the contrary? I suggest looking at the apocalypse of weeks in 1 Enoch. There might be, if I recall here was an attempt to re-establish a then disused jubilee year concept by one of the kings of Judah/Israel. He may have chosen a year to be his jubilee year arbitrarily, Queen of England style, but it was probably a sabbatical year, which were observed to allow redemption of debts for rights to use property owned by the temple that had been sold to others for immediate cash. The former possessors can redeem their land by paying back the loan at those set 7 year periods. But there is talk that even that is not necessarily successive 7 year periods, but a 7 year window for redemption, like a modern sales contract.
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DCH
Stephen, I'm not interested in people that were pretty illiterate, or innumerate, long term calendar-wise....StephenGoranson wrote: ↑Sun Mar 10, 2024 5:34 am maryhelena above, Sat Mar 09, 2024 3:28 pm, in part:
"I did not respond to that post as I think it's for Jewish historians to make a judgement on their own history...."
But you have made precisely such judgements, hundreds of times.
I agree with David, above Sun Mar 10, 2024 1:36 am, that you have not here shown that ancient people even noticed your 100-year notes.
Of course they remembered major events, good and bad, but most people then were pretty illiterate, or innumerate, long-term calendar-wise.
The last Hasmonean, after the civil war they caused, may not have been seen 100 years later as a great pivot, though you say so.
Poet and Professor Paul Muldoon reading Yeats’ 'The Second Coming' (1920).I do agree with you, though, that Blake and Yeats were great poets. Including both versions of "When You Are Old."
If you are asking did Josephus put up a little red flag to indicate that he was going to write something about the 100 years between 63 b.c. and 37 c.e. then the answer is No. That he wrote a story dealing with 37 c.e. is found in Antiquities. Does that story have relevance to earlier Hasmonean history - that question can be raised. And no, Stephen, I'm not going to get into a debate about Josephus with you. The focus of this thread is on the seditious Jesus hypostasis raised by Bermejo- Rubio's new book - - hypothesis raised also by Steven Brian Pounds in the above referenced pdf.StephenGoranson wrote: ↑Sun Mar 10, 2024 7:16 am maryhelena wrote above, in part:
"I'm interested in the Jewish historian Josephus, claiming descent from the Hasmoneans, who wrote lots of stuff about history...."
Did Josephus mention any of your [modern-view] 100-year spans?