bcedaifu wrote:Sheshbazzar wrote:
Sounds like it would be a fundamental requirement for this 'Christos' religious cult movement, that a Jewish person must first learn, accept, and employ Greek religious terminology and names in order to join to, or to be accounted as a adherent of the 'Christos' cult.
I don't agree.
To adhere to the new "christian" faith, or whatever they would have called themselves, at the outset, (for I understand that "christian", as a word, appears in the fourth century for the first time), it would have been necessary firstfor a Jew to acknowledge that Paul's "new" covenant had merit.
Where do you get the idea that this had to be 'Paul's "new" covenant' _
exclusively?
Any Jew who could or can read Hebrew could and can read;
הנה ימים באים נאם־יהוה וכרתי את־בית ישראל ואת־בית יהודה ברית חדשה׃
לא כברית אשר כרתי את־אבותם ביום החזיקי בידם להוציאם מארץ מצרים אשר־המה הפרו את־בריתי ואנכי בעלתי בם נאם־יהוה׃
or in reading Greek, could and can read in the LXX;
ἰδοὺ ἡμέραι ἔρχονται φησὶν κύριος καὶ διαθήσομαι τῷ οἴκῳ Ισραηλ καὶ τῷ οἴκῳ Ιουδα διαθήκην καινήν
οὐ κατὰ τὴν διαθήκην ἣν διεθέμην τοῖς πατράσιν αὐτῶν ἐν ἡμέρᾳ ἐπιλαβομένου μου τῆς χειρὸς αὐτῶν ἐξαγαγεῖν αὐτοὺς ἐκ γῆς Αἰγύπτου ὅτι αὐτοὶ οὐκ ἐνέμειναν ἐν τῇ διαθήκῃ μου καὶ ἐγὼ ἠμέλησα αὐτῶν φησὶν κύριος
And known that a 'NEW' Covenant; 'One NOT according to that Covenant made with the Fathers in the wilderness' was in the offing.
'Paul' certainly was
not the first, nor the only one to announce this New Covenant, and the Scriptural Promises made to the GENTILES that believe in The Holy One of Israel.
Why would any Jew accept the notion that a lay person could announce a "new" covenant, one that throws out the former contract between God and his chosen people, and replaces it with a novel agreement, demanding equality among the despised gentiles and Jews intermingled together, as if the two groups shared something in common?
Perhaps because Jews who were well acquainted with the content of the Tanakh, and with the specific promises made therein, first to 'Jews', and subsequently to 'all of the NATIONS of the earth', it wasn't news of anything that they had not long expected.
Eat pork? Drink blood? Cease circumcision?
Jews are Jews. Gentiles (other '
nations') are Gentiles, and the two are never the same. Not even in Revelations.
Different peoples, separate, and subject if willing, to different sets of rules.
Replace Moses with Paul?
Only if you 'buy' the content of texts that catholocism spent centuries in
cooking.
Moses, and The Law which was by Moses is never replaced. What laws of foods, clothes, and of Sabbath and Festival observances, Moses wrote of, applies only to Torah observant Jews.
Never in Moses did these apply to righteous '
ger toshavim' the 'strangers within thy gates'.
These, freely living in their uncircumcision of the flesh, were
barred from the eating of the Passover Seder, and so being, never were 'under' nor subject to the restrictions of that Covenant which Scripturally Moses enjoined upon the nation of Israel alone out of all the earth's peoples.
Are you serious? No Jew, of any flavor, would have accepted the essence of Christianity.
Yes, I am very serious. Sorry dude. But
some Jews most certainly did,
some Jews most certainly have, and
some Jews most certainly
do 'accept the essence' of The Way.
And over the centuries, the total number of Jews walking in The Way numbers into the tens of thousands.
Had he existed, Jesus would have been viewed by Jews as yet another false pretender.
Obviously he was by most Jews. But again, at any given point in history there have always been those of Jewish birth and upbringing who
have and
do embrace Y'shuah ha'Notzeri as being ha'Meshiach and their '
Ga'al (Redeemer)
Christianity began with all kinds of yokels, but most assuredly, not with Jews.
As I have stated before, these 1st century Jews who accepted ha'Adon Y'shuah ha'Meshiach as being their Redeeming kinsman did not use the word 'Christian', many lived out their Torah observant lives never having heard of any such foreign fabricated insult, much less applied it to themselves.
Sheshbazzar
