The theology of Jesus of Nazareth

[Clive]

I wonder if another way to approach the discussions here would be to ask if there are theological reasons behind the life story details we have, like a carpenter, coming from Nazareth etc.

[Peter Kirby]

How much time do you have? A trip through the literature will reveal a "theological reason" being mentioned for most details.

[neilgodfrey]

Without going into any detail here is a list of "life story details" from Mark for which I have read theological explanations:

Baptism
Temptation in wilderness
Calling of disciples
Exorcisms
Healings
Parables
Confrontations with Pharisees etc
Strained relations with family
Nature miracles
Altercations and dialogues with disciples
Transfiguration
Geographical settings
Topographical settings
Personal names of disciples and others
Itinerary of Jesus' travels
Crowds, wilderness, audiences, lakes, houses,
Entry into Jerusalem
Temple action
Foot washing
Betrayal
Passover
Desertion by disciples
Naked man
Prophetic announcements
The Passion Narrative
Women watching from afar
Empty tomb
Fleeing women at the end
Message to meet him in Galilee

[outhouse]

I wonder if another way to approach the discussions here would be to ask if there are theological reasons behind the life story details we have, like a carpenter, coming from Nazareth etc.

Tekton in this period is an insult, and we see the later authors layering to this, trying to downplay it.

Nazareth was a hovel and a terrible place to live in that time. You had Sepphoris 4 miles away that was life in opulence.



Now I have seen YEC twist the facts of evolution into theology, so I guess it all depends on how professional you look at the evidence.

[neilgodfrey]

Jesus is called a ‘tekton/artisan’ in response to the rhetorical reference to “mighty works wrought by his hands“. (Mark 6:2-3).

Now “handiwork” is exactly what a tekton does.

Doesn’t this come across as another example of Mark’s portrayal of the spiritual blindness of the lesser mortals — similar to sceptics saying: Is this the shepherd/potter of Israel? And the narrator has them trip over themselves by replying: Nah, just a shepherd/potter.

Whether the tekton reference is historical or not, there certainly appears to be literary artifice in the way it is introduced. And perhaps not only literary artifice, but also theological intent. Does not Mark regularly depict spiritual blindness by mundane images taken at face value, and elsewhere lace his stories with details that are really spiritual symbols? (the fruitless fig tree, leaven, temple destruction and rebuilding in 3 days, blind Bartimaeus’s garment, healing the blind, 40 days in wilderness, Simon-Jairus inverted parallels, etc.)

Does not this literary and theological context of Mark give some cause to pause before assuming the tekton reference is referring to historical reality?

Does it not look as if the tekton/carpenter/artisan job of Jesus is planted there by Mark in “Markan-ironic” response to the charge that he was rumoured to have produced so many “great works by his hands”.

I should add to the above the additional irony (if it were intended) that according to both Cicero and Sirach people of the artisan class were incapable of aspiring to any sort of higher “wisdom”. Note the cynical reference to “wisdom” in the Markan passage. See Sirach 38:24-34 and Cicero, Off. 1.150-51 as evidence that Jews and Romans did not believe an artisan can be “counted among the wise, educated, and learned”.

(From a 2010 post)

[Clive]

Where is the historical core?

[outhouse]

Doesn’t this come across as another example of Mark’s portrayal of the spiritual blindness of the lesser mortals

Only if one completely ignores that later authors tried to reduce Marks statement.

[neilgodfrey]

Doesn’t this come across as another example of Mark’s portrayal of the spiritual blindness of the lesser mortals

Only if one completely ignores that later authors tried to reduce Marks statement.

How can later authors change what Mark himself was doing in his own work?

[outhouse]

http://www.bibleinterp.com/review/man35821.shtml

As scholars have recently noted, the word usually translated “carpenter” (tekton) can also mean someone who worked with his hands, or a stone worker. As Joseph may have done stonework and manual labor rather than being a craftsman with wood, this would have put him in the lowest of the lower class. Therefore, the family Jesus grew up in would not have owned land, but they would have been subsistence farmers accustomed to menial labor. According to Stephen Patterson, the family of Jesus was a step below the normal peasant. This being the case, neither Joseph nor Jesus was a carpenter; they were more likely workers with stone and general manual labor.


Mark



Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary and brother of James and Joses and Judas and Simon, and are not his sisters here with us?"


Matthew

Is not this the carpenter's son? Is not his mother called Mary? And are not his brothers James and Joseph and Simon and Judas?


Here in Matthew, tekton is changed from Jesus himself, to only his father being a Tekton

Later down the road we have Luke, with no mention at all of this

[neilgodfrey]

http://www.bibleinterp.com/review/man35821.shtml

As scholars have recently noted, the word usually translated “carpenter” (tekton) can also mean someone who worked with his hands, or a stone worker. As Joseph may have done stonework and manual labor rather than being a craftsman with wood, this would have put him in the lowest of the lower class. Therefore, the family Jesus grew up in would not have owned land, but they would have been subsistence farmers accustomed to menial labor. According to Stephen Patterson, the family of Jesus was a step below the normal peasant. This being the case, neither Joseph nor Jesus was a carpenter; they were more likely workers with stone and general manual labor.


Mark



Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary and brother of James and Joses and Judas and Simon, and are not his sisters here with us?"


Matthew

Is not this the carpenter's son? Is not his mother called Mary? And are not his brothers James and Joseph and Simon and Judas?


Here in Matthew, tekton is changed from Jesus himself, to only his father being a Tekton

Later down the road we have Luke, with no mention at all of this

Presumably this is a response to my own query. Of course later authors can change what an earlier author wrote. That goes without saying. But however much they change the story for their own interests and purposes they can't change what the original author meant to convey.

The point remains that the earliest source for the tekton image in relation to Jesus is Mark and it is arguably composed to serve a theological function.