the 'Sibylline Books' and the "Sibylline Oracles"

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MrMacSon
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the 'Sibylline Books' and the "Sibylline Oracles"

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Do we know if these texts had much influence during their respective, somewhat-overlapping periods of prominence before and after the 1st and 2nd centuries? Note the Sibylline Books seem to have been destroyed in 83 BC and replaced a few years later, seemingly with newer contemporaneous prophecies. It seems the new version further had a "new copy" made ~12 BC when they were moved to the Temple of Apollo by Augustus.
The Sibylline Books (Latin: Libri Sibyllini) were a collection of oracular utterances, set out in Greek hexameters that, according to tradition, were purchased from a sibyl by the last king of Rome, Tarquinius Superbus; and were consulted at momentous crises through the history of the Republic and the Empire. Only fragments have survived, the rest being lost or deliberately destroyed.

The Sibylline Books should not be confused with the so-called Sibylline Oracles, twelve books of prophecies thought to be of Judaeo-Christian origin ...

The Roman Senate kept tight control over the Sibylline Books;[1] Sibylline Books were entrusted to the care of two patricians; after 367 BC ten custodians were appointed, five patricians and five plebeians, who were called the decemviri sacris faciundis; subsequently (probably in the time of Sulla) their number was increased to fifteen, the quindecimviri sacris faciundis. They were usually ex-consuls or ex-praetors. They held office for life, and were exempt from all other public duties. They had the responsibility of keeping the books in safety and secrecy. These officials, at the command of the Senate, consulted the Sibylline Books in order to discover not exact predictions of definite future events in the form of prophecy, but the religious observances necessary to avert extraordinary calamities and to expiate ominous prodigies (comets and earthquakes, showers of stones, plague, and the like). It was only the rites of expiation prescribed by the Sibylline Books, according to the interpretation of the oracle that were communicated to the public, and not the oracles themselves, which left ample opportunity for abuses.

.. The Sibylline Books motivated the construction of eight temples in ancient Rome, aside from those cults that have been interpreted as mediated by the Sibylline Books simply by the Greek nature of the deity.[2] Thus, one important effect of the Sibylline Books was their influence on applying Greek cult practice and Greek conceptions of deities to indigenous Roman religion, which was already indirectly influenced through Etruscan religion. As the Sibylline Books had been collected in Anatolia, in the neighborhood of Troy, they recognized the gods and goddesses and the rites observed there and helped introduce them into Roman state worship, a syncretic amalgamation of national deities with the corresponding deities of Greece, and a general modification of the Roman religion.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylline_Books

2 - Eric M. Orlin (2002). Temples, Religion, and Politics in the Roman Republic; Ch. 3 "The Sibylline Books".
The influence of the books brought eastern gods such as Apollo, the "Great Mother" Cybele, and Ceres, as well as Greek pagan beliefs, into the Roman pagan religion.

Because the verses were written in Greek, the keepers would always be helped by two Greek translators. The books were destroyed when the Temple of Jupiter burned down in 83 BC. Because of this, the Roman Senate sent messengers in 76 BC to find similar prophecies and replace them. The prophecies were gathered especially from Troy, Erythrae, Samos island, 'Africa' (that is, modern Tunisia), and from Sicily and Tibur in Italy. After they brought the new collection to Rome, Roman priests separated what they thought was true, but threw others out of the collection.

The Roman Emperor Augustus in 12 BC moved them to the Temple of Apollo, when they were studied and a new copy was made. They stayed there until 405 AD. It is said that at that time, Stilicho, who fought for the teachings of Arianism, burnt them.

http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylline_Books
Modern scholars believe these Sibylline Books are not the same as the Sibylline Oracles that were often quoted by early Christian writers from the 2nd century through the 5th century AD. It is certain that when one Christian writer, Athenagoras of Athens, wrote A Plea for the Christians to Emperor Marcus Aurelius in around 176 AD, at a time when Christians were being punished by the pagan Roman Empire, he quoted word-for-word from these Oracles that are known today. Quoting them, along with writings by Homer and Hesiod, he wrote many times that "these books are all known to Caesar" (the Emperor). The Sibylline Books were still to be found in the Temple of Apollo at Rome at this time, so it is thought possible that at least some of these Sibylline Oracles were partly the same.

http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylline_Books
Relationship with the "Sibylline Oracles"

The Sibylline Oracles were quoted by the Roman-Jewish historian Josephus (late 1st century), as well as by numerous Christian writers of the second century, including Athenagoras of Athens who, in a letter addressed to Marcus Aurelius in ca. AD 176, quoted verbatim a section of the extant Oracles, in the midst of a lengthy series of other classical and pagan references such as Homer and Hesiod, stating several times that all these works should already be familiar to the Roman Emperor. Copies of the actual Sibylline Books (as reconstituted in 76 BC) were still in the Roman Temple at this time. The Oracles are nevertheless thought by modern scholars to be anonymous compilations that assumed their final form in the fifth century, after the Sibylline Books perished. They are a miscellaneous collection of Jewish and Christian portents of future disasters, that may illustrate the confusions about sibyls that were accumulating among Christians of Late Antiquity.[5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylline_Books

5 - http://www.sacred-texts.com/cla/sib/sib15.htm
Last edited by MrMacSon on Mon May 04, 2015 1:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: the 'Sibylline Books' and the "Sibylline Oracles"

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It seems early Church Fathers were associated with the Sibylline Oracles - http://www.sacred-texts.com/cla/sib/sib15.htm
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Re: the 'Sibylline Books' and the "Sibylline Oracles"

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MrMacSon wrote:It seems early Church Fathers were associated with the Sibylline Oracles - http://www.sacred-texts.com/cla/sib/sib15.htm
There has been a lot of study of the S. Oracles. What was passed down to present by Christian scribes is a composite document, with sections that are clearly Pagan, Jewish, and Christian in orientation. In some cases, oracles composed by Jewish and Pagan authors were redacted by Christian scribes.

R H Charles published an English translation of book III of the Oracles in Apocrypha & Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament (Pseudepigrapha volume, 2, 1910?), because it was believed to have been written by Jewish authors and represented one brand of inter-testamental Hellenized Judaism. This book has been scanned and is available online just about everywhere.

The whole corpus (all the various books) was also translated into English and published in one of R Charlesworth's two volume Old Testament Pseudepigrapha (1983?). Believe me, if you like footnotes, and lots of eradication (of the good kind) you will be in heaven.

DCH (work calls me like a moth to a flame)
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Re: the 'Sibylline Books' and the "Sibylline Oracles"

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lol. There is reference to the Sibylline books in the infamous Tacitus Annals 15.44 (I include 15.42-3 for context).
42 1 However, Nero turned to account the ruins of his fatherland by building a palace,22 the marvels of which were to consist not so much in gems and gold, materials long familiar and vulgarized by luxury, as in fields and lakes and the air of solitude given by wooded ground alternating with clear tracts and open landscapes. The architects and engineers were Severus and Celer, who had the ingenuity and the courage to try the force of art even against the veto of nature and to fritter away the resources of a Caesar. They had undertaken to sink a navigable canal23 running from Lake Avernus to the mouths of the Tiber along a desolate shore or through intervening hills; for the one district along the route moist enough to yield a supply of water is the Pomptine Marsh;24 the rest being cliff and sand, which could be cut through, if at all, only by intolerable exertions for which no p281 sufficient motive existed.25 None the less, Nero, with his passion for the incredible, made an effort to tunnel the height nearest the Avernus, and some evidences of that futile ambition survive.

43 1 In the capital, however, the districts spared by the palace were rebuilt, not, as after the Gallic fire, indiscriminately and piecemeal, but in measured lines of streets, with broad thoroughfares, buildings of restricted height, and open spaces, while colonnades were added as a protection to the front of the tenement-blocks. These colonnades Nero offered to erect at his own expense, and also to hand over the building-sites, clear of rubbish, to the owners. He made a further offer of rewards, proportioned to the rank and resources of the various claimants, and fixed a term within which houses or blocks of tenement must be completed, if the bounty was to be secured. As the receptacle of the refuse he settled upon the Ostian Marshes, and gave orders that vessels which had carried grain up the Tiber must run down-stream laden with débris. The buildings themselves, to an extent definitely specified, were to be solid, untimbered structures of Gabine or Alban stone,26 that particular stone being proof against fire. Again, there was to be a guard to ensure that the water-supply — intercepted by private lawlessnessa — should be available for public purposes in greater quantities and at more points; appliances for checking fire were to be kept by everyone in the open; there were to be no joint partitions between buildings, but each was to be surrounded by its own walls. These reforms, welcomed for their utility, were also beneficial to the appearance of the new capital. Still, there were p283 those who held that the old form had been the more salubrious, as the narrow streets and high-built houses were not so easily penetrated by the rays of the sun; while now the broad expanses, with no protecting shadows, glowed under a more oppressive heat.


44 1 So far, the precautions taken were suggested by human prudence: now means were sought for appeasing deity, and application was made to the Sibylline books; at the injunction of which public prayers were offered to Vulcan, Ceres, and Proserpine, while Juno was propitiated by the matrons, first in the Capitol, then at the nearest point of the sea-shore, where water was drawn for sprinkling the temple and image of the goddess. Ritual banquets and all-night vigils were celebrated by women in the married state. But neither human help, nor imperial munificence, nor all the modes of placating Heaven, could stifle scandal or dispel the belief that the fire had taken place by order. Therefore, to scotch the rumour, Nero substituted as culprits, and punished with the utmost refinements of cruelty, a class of men, loathed for their vices,27 whom the crowd styled Christians.28 Christus, the founder of the name, had undergone the death penalty in the reign of Tiberius, by sentence of the procurator Pontius Pilatus,29 and the pernicious superstition was checked for a moment, only to break out once more, not merely in Judaea, the home of the disease, but in the capital itself, where all things horrible or shameful in the world collect and find a vogue. First, then, the confessed members of the sect were arrested; next, on their disclosures, vast p285 numbers30 were convicted, not so much on the count of arson as for hatred of the human race.31 And derision accompanied their end: they were covered with wild beasts' skins and torn to death by dogs; or they were fastened on crosses, and, when daylight failed were burned to serve as lamps by night. Nero had offered his Gardens for the spectacle, and gave an exhibition in his Circus, mixing with the crowd in the habit of a charioteer, or mounted on his car. Hence, in spite of a guilt which had earned the most exemplary punishment, there arose a sentiment of pity, due to the impression that they were being sacrificed not for the welfare of the state but to the ferocity of a single man.

45 1 Meanwhile, Italy had been laid waste for contributions of money; the provinces, the federate communities, and the so‑called free states, were ruined. The gods themselves formed part of the plunder, as the ravaged temples of the capital were drained of the gold dedicated in the triumphs or the vows, the prosperity or the fears, of the Roman nation at every epoch. But in Asia and Achaia, not offerings alone but the images of deity were being swept away, since Acratus and Carrinas Secundus had been despatched into the two provinces. The former was a freedman prepared for any enormity; the latter, as far as words went, was a master of Greek philosophy, but his character remained untinctured by the virtues. Seneca, it was rumoured, to divert the odium of sacrilege from p287 himself, had asked leave to retire to a distant estate in the country, and, when it was not accorded, had feigned illness — a neuralgic affection, he said — and declined to leave his bedroom. Some have put it on record that, by the orders of Nero, poison had been prepared for him by one of his freedmen, Cleonicus by name; and that, owing either to the man's revelations or to his own alarms, it was avoided by Seneca, who supported life upon an extremely simple diet of field fruits and, if thirst was insistent, spring water.

http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/R ... /15B*.html
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Re: the 'Sibylline Books' and the "Sibylline Oracles"

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MrMacSon wrote:lol. There is reference to the Sibylline books in the infamous Tacitus Annals 15.44 (I include 15.42-3 for context)
It can be said that, as a reference from Tacitus, this is referring to the pagan Sibylline books (which were destroyed), not the Jewish&Christian forgeries.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylline_Oracles
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylline_Books
An incomplete list of consultations of the Sibylline Books recorded by historians:
399 BC: The books were consulted following a pestilence, resulting in the institution of the lectisternium ceremony. (Livy 5,13)
348 BC: A plague struck Rome after a brief skirmish with the Gauls and Greeks. Another lectisternium was ordered. (Livy 7,27)
345 BC: The books were consulted when a "shower of stones rained down and darkness filled the sky during daylight". Publius Valerius Publicola was appointed dictator to arrange a public holiday for religious observances. (Livy 7, 28)
295 BC: They were consulted again following a pestilence, and reports that large numbers of Appius Claudius' army had been struck by lightning. A Temple was built to Venus near the Circus Maximus. (Livy 10,31)
293 BC: After yet another plague, the books were consulted, with the prescription being 'that Aesculapius must be brought to Rome from Epidaurus'; however, the Senate, being preoccupied with the Samnite wars, took no steps beyond performing one day of public prayers to Aesculapius. (Livy 10,47)
240/238 BC: The Ludi Florales, or "Flower Games", were instituted after consulting the books.
216 BC: When Hannibal annihilated the Roman Legions at Cannae, the books were consulted, and on their recommendation, two Gauls and two Greeks were buried alive in the city's marketplace.
205-204 BC: During the Second Punic War, upon consultation of the Sibylline Books, an image of Cybele was transferred from Pessinos (or Pergamon) to Rome. An embassy was sent to Attalus I of Pergamon to negotiate the transfer. Publius Cornelius Scipio Nasica and Claudia Quinta were said to have received the image of Cybele at Ostia on her arrival in 204 BC. Cybele's image was placed within the Temple of Victory on the Palatine. In honour of Cybele a lecisternium was performed and her games, the Megalesia, were held.[6] The image of Cybele was moved to the Temple of the Magna Mater in 191 BC when the temple was dedicated by Marcus Junius Brutus in the consulship of Publius Cornelius Scipio Nasica.[7] A fragment of Valerius Antias from Livy's Ab Urbe Condita 36.36.4 records that Megalesia were again held in 191 BC and that "[they] were the first to be held with dramatic performances."[8]
143 BC: Frontinus relates a story in which the Decemvirs consulted the books on another matter and found that a proposed project for the Marcia Aqueduct was improper, along with the Anio. After a debate in the Senate the project was resumed, presumably the necessity for water outweighed the oracle. Sextus Julius Frontinus, Aqueducts of Rome, Book I, Ch 7.
63 BC: Believing in a prediction of the books that 'three Cornelii' would dominate Rome, Publius Cornelius Lentulus Sura took part in the conspiracy of Catiline (Plutarch, Life of Cicero, XVII)
ca. 55 BC: As Romans deliberated sending a force to restore Ptolemy XII to the throne of Egypt, lightning struck the statue of Jupiter on the Alban Mount; the oracles were consulted, and one was found to read "If the King of Egypt comes to you asking for assistance, refuse him not your friendship, yet do not grant him any army, or else you will have toil and danger". This considerably delayed Ptolemy's return. (Dio Cassius History of Rome 39:15)
44 BC: According to Suetonius, a sibylline prediction that only a king could triumph over Parthia fueled rumors that Caesar, leader of the then-republic, was aspiring to kingship. (Caesar, 79)
15 AD: When the Tiber river flooded the lower parts of Rome, one of the priests suggested consulting the books, but Emperor Tiberius refused, preferring to keep the divine things secret. (Tacitus, Annales I, 76)
271: The books were consulted following the Roman defeat at Placentia by the Alamanni.
312: Maxentius consulted the Sibylline Books in preparation for combat with Constantine, who had just taken all of Maxentius' northern Italian cities and was marching on Rome.
363: Julian the Apostate consulted the books in preparation for marching against the Sassanids. The response mailed from Rome "in plain terms warned him not to quit his own territories that year." (Ammianus Marcellinus, History of Rome, XXIII 1, 7)
405: Stilicho ordered the destruction of the Sibylline Books, possibly because Sibylline prophecies were being used to attack his government in the face of the attack of Alaric I.
"... almost every critical biblical position was earlier advanced by skeptics." - Raymond Brown
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Re: the 'Sibylline Books' and the "Sibylline Oracles"

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Yes,
The Oracles are nevertheless thought by modern scholars to be anonymous compilations that assumed their final form in the fifth century, after the Sibylline Books perished. They are a miscellaneous collection of Jewish and Christian portents of future disasters, that may illustrate the confusions about sibyls that were accumulating among Christians of Late Antiquity.[5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylline_Books

5 - http://www.sacred-texts.com/cla/sib/sib15.htm
eta, it's interesting that Theophilus of Antioch et al were using the Oracles - http://www.sacred-texts.com/cla/sib/sib15.htm
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Re: the 'Sibylline Books' and the "Sibylline Oracles"

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The Syblline books were recovered, and exist. July 6th 83 B.C. destroyed the temple. One column, buried 3 meters below the surface boasted hundreds of bores, with molten bronze, a testament to the keeping of years by driving nails into the "year column"
Yes even further below lies a stone vault, and within that vault lies the destiny of the world.
Seek....
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