Who's afraid of Jesus Terminator?

Discussion about the New Testament, apocrypha, gnostics, church fathers, Christian origins, historical Jesus or otherwise, etc.
Thor
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Re: Who's afraid of Jesus Terminator?

Post by Thor » Wed Jul 08, 2015 12:03 am

Giuseppe wrote: It would be more expected, in my opinion, this sequence:
Mark 5:7 ---> Mark 5:6
and not viceversa.

It would be more expected, in my opinion, that in a original version of that story, the possessed man said those words of awe at the first sight of Jesus, not following (in a cause-effect link) his explicit rebuke.
Now I am confused. Are they insertions or have the sequences been tampered with?

Giuseppe
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Re: Who's afraid of Jesus Terminator?

Post by Giuseppe » Wed Jul 08, 2015 12:20 am

Of course I'm supposing the priority of the marcionite Evangelion here.

Therefore not ''insertions'' in a previous hypothetical gMark o gLuke, but only different gospels based on a previous heretical gospel.
Nihil enim in speciem fallacius est quam prava religio. -Liv. xxxix. 16.

Thor
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Re: Who's afraid of Jesus Terminator?

Post by Thor » Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:20 am

Giuseppe wrote:Of course I'm supposing the priority of the marcionite Evangelion here.

Therefore not ''insertions'' in a previous hypothetical gMark o gLuke, but only different gospels based on a previous heretical gospel.
So the Marcionitte Evangelion not only pre-dated gLuke, but also gMark?

Giuseppe
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Re: Who's afraid of Jesus Terminator?

Post by Giuseppe » Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:12 am

precisely.
Nihil enim in speciem fallacius est quam prava religio. -Liv. xxxix. 16.

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Re: Who's afraid of Jesus Terminator?

Post by Peter Kirby » Wed Jul 08, 2015 7:35 am

Ben C. Smith wrote:
Roger Pearse wrote:Has anybody noticed that this site is copying the contents of this forum?

http://christianorigins.com/link/2015/0 ... minator-3/

I noticed them reposting my blog posts. Then I found that link.
Hi, Roger. That is the newest Peter Kirby effort, initiated at least partly in order to publicize the forum; see here for details: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1653.

Ben.
The average number of links clicked, versus the number of visitors from search engines (60%) and other links online (40% - mostly from Early Christian Writings, this forum, my blog, Vridar, and Twitter), not counting bookmarks and direct traffic, is 1.2 links clicked per visitor. That's 2 links clicked for every search engine visitor to the site (including bounces, i.e., averaging those with more and with 1 or 0). You could call that a net positive in traffic flow (for the sites being linked), created by the existence of the aggregator. More importantly, many of these visitors are engaging in discovery. They're finding out about blogs (and forums) that they may never knew even existed.

Here are the links clicked from "all time" (the couple of weeks the site has been running).

Image

The quotations are limited to 50 words and establish the context of the article quoted. Sites without RSS feeds visible to the public weren't added. Material not in the RSS feed is not quoted. Someone who thinks too much is quoted can shorten the size of text transmitted in their RSS feed.
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Secret Alias
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Re: Who's afraid of Jesus Terminator?

Post by Secret Alias » Wed Jul 08, 2015 9:44 am

Nice idea DCH. Probably correct.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote

Giuseppe
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Re: Who's afraid of Jesus Terminator?

Post by Giuseppe » Sat Jul 11, 2015 6:10 am

Luke 22:33-42 is absent in Mcn. In red I put the Lukan additions:

26 They sailed to the region of the Gerasenes, which is across the lake from Galilee. 27 When Jesus stepped ashore, he was met by a demon-possessed man from the town. For a long time this man had not worn clothes or lived in a house, but had lived in the tombs. 28 When he saw Jesus, he cried out and fell at his feet, shouting at the top of his voice, “What do you want with me, Jesus, Son of the Most High God? I beg you, don’t torture me!” 29 For Jesus had commanded the impure spirit to come out of the man. Many times it had seized him, and though he was chained hand and foot and kept under guard, he had broken his chains and had been driven by the demon into solitary places.

30 Jesus asked him, “What is your name?”

“Legion,” he replied, because many demons had gone into him. 31 And they begged Jesus repeatedly not to order them to go into the Abyss.

32 A large herd of pigs was feeding there on the hillside. The demons begged Jesus to let them go into the pigs, and he gave them permission.
33 When the demons came out of the man, they went into the pigs, and the herd rushed down the steep bank into the lake and was drowned.

34 When those tending the pigs saw what had happened, they ran off and reported this in the town and countryside, 35 and the people went out to see what had happened. When they came to Jesus, they found the man from whom the demons had gone out, sitting at Jesus’ feet, dressed and in his right mind; and they were afraid. 36 Those who had seen it told the people how the demon-possessed man had been cured. 37 Then all the people of the region of the Gerasenes asked Jesus to leave them, because they were overcome with fear. So he got into the boat and left.

38 The man from whom the demons had gone out begged to go with him, but Jesus sent him away, saying, 39 “Return home and tell how much God has done for you.” So the man went away and told all over town how much Jesus had done for him.


Why verses 8:33-42 were not found in Mcn?

The reason is in the fact that Jesus had shown compassion for demons allowing them to slip into the swine and not plunging them into the abyss, as they feared (under the mistaken belief that Jesus was the warrior Messiah of the god Creator).

since the protocatholic Luke wanted to remove that ambiguity (because for him Jesus was the Messiah of the God of the Jews), he inserted the particular of pigs that slip off the cliff, so as to remove forever the idea that Jesus was so good as to leave a way of salvation to the demons.

(For Recall that the good god of Marcion did not condemn anyone).

but then so it is explained the reason why the demons were called Legion. They were the pagan gods protectors of Romans, so they had every reason to believe that Jesus was the Terminator sent from YHWH (and expected in Jewish Scriptures) to punish them and drive them into the abyss.

So the original marcionite symbolic meaning of the ''Legion'' has been lost after what our canonical gospels did by correcting the heretic gospel Mcn, but in doing so they have turned the ''Legion'' in a reference to one of those clues that Professor Bermejo-Rubio called ''pattern of seditious clues'' (moving him to apply wrongly the criterion of embarrassment on them).
Nihil enim in speciem fallacius est quam prava religio. -Liv. xxxix. 16.

Giuseppe
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Re: Who's afraid of Jesus Terminator?

Post by Giuseppe » Sat Jul 11, 2015 6:50 am

...thus creating the need for an apology from the Catholic side against those who suspected by that time that the 'historical Jesus' was a seditious anti-Roman.
Nihil enim in speciem fallacius est quam prava religio. -Liv. xxxix. 16.

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