What's your Opinion on Testimonium Flavianum

[Ben C. Smith]

My Testimonium Interface is still up and running, as well; it allows any two passages (both text and translation) to be compared side by side. Here is the list of texts and translations available:

Josephus:Antiquities of the Jews 18.3.3 §63-64 (century I), textus receptus.
Origen 1: On Matthew 10.17 (century III).
Origen 2: Against Celsus 1.47 (century III).
Eusebius 1: History of the Church 1.11.7b-8 (century IV).
Eusebius 2: Demonstration of the Gospel 3.5.105-106 (century IV).
Eusebius 3: Theophany 5.44 (century IV).
Gregory (pseudo-Gregory): On the Cognition of God (allegedly century IV, but actually century IX).
Ambrose (pseudo-Hegesippus): On the Downfall of Jerusalem 2.12 (century IV), pseudonymous.
Jerome 1: On Famous Men 13 (century V).
Jerome 2: Greek translation of On Famous Men 13.
Rufinus: Latin translation of History of the Church 1.11.7b-8 (century V).
Isidore of Pelusium: Book 4, epistle 225 (century V).
Sozomen: History of the Church 1.1.5 (century V).
Anonymous: Against the Jews 10 (century V or VI).
Dialogue: Religious Dialogue at the Sassanid Court (century V or VI).
Oecumenius: Commentary on the Apocalypse 88 (century VI).
George Monachus 1: Chronicon (century IX).
George Monachus 2: Chronicon Breve (century IX).
John Malalas: Chronography 10 (century IX).
Haimo: Epitome of Sacred History 1.13 (century IX).
Agapius: History of the World (century X); Pines, pages 9-10.
Suda: Lexicon iota 503 (century X).
Constantine VII Porphyrogenitus: On Virtues and Vices 1.84 (century X).
Symeon Logothetes: Chronicon 59 (century X).
George Cedrenus: Compendium of History (century XI).
John Zonoras: Epitome of History (century XI or XII).
Michael the Syrian: Chronicle (century XII); Pines, page 26.
Michael Glycas: Annals (century XII).
Peter Comestor: Scholastic History (century XII).
John Salisbury: Polycraticus 2.9 (century XII).

[DCHindley]

Thanks Ben,

Here is a table with the 56+ sources I consider relevant to analysis of passages about John the Baptist, Jesus/Christ and James the Just (or other family). There is the possibility that there are some dupes (e.g., author and/or name of book known by multiple names):

Subject	Author	Source
TF summary	Agapius of Hierapolis,	Kitab al-‘Unwan (chronicle of the world)
Christ as Just and Good man, per Josephus, showing well signs of omens	Anonymous (Anastasias Abbas?),	Against the Jews 10
Jesus the Man-Prophet predicted by scripture	Author of gospel of Luke,	Luke 24.19b-21, 25-27
TF	Constantine VII Porphyrogenitus,	On Virtues and Vices, 1.84
Jesus Christ prophesied of in Judean scriptures	Eusebius,	Demonstration of the Gospel 1.1.3-6, 8, 10.
TF	Eusebius,	Demonstration of the Gospel 3.5.104b-106
John the Baptist in Josephus	Eusebius,	Demonstration of the Gospel 9.5.15
John the Baptist in Josephus	Eusebius,	History of the Church 1.11.1-6
TF in Greek & Latin compared	Eusebius,	History of the Church 1.11.7-8, & Jerome's translation.
After Lord's Ascension, apostles appoint James the Just as Bishop of Jerusalem, and drilling down on who exactly he was, in Clement of Alexandria, Hypotyposeis (lost)	Eusebius,	History of the Church 2.1.3-6
James the Just in Hegesippus	Eusebius,	History of the Church 2.23.3-25
Successors to James the Just as Bishop of Jerusalem	Eusebius,	History of the Church 3.11.1-2
James the Just in Hegesippus	Eusebius,	History of the Church 3.19.1; 20.1-6
James the Just in Hegesippus	Eusebius,	History of the Church 3.32.1-8
The Lord's family continues to succeed James the Just as Bishop of Jerusalem	Eusebius,	History of the Church 4.22.4
TF	Eusebius,	Theophany 5.43b-44.
TF resume	George Cedrenus,	Compendium of History
TF	George Monachus,	Chronicon
TF	George Monachus,	Chronicon breve
TF	Haimo of Auxerre,	Epitome of Sacred History 1.12b-13
TF	Isidore Pelusiota,	Letters 4.225
TF	Jerome	On Famous Men
Josephus attributes destruction of city to death of James the Just & Hegesippus's account of James' death	Jerome	On Famous Men 2
TF resume	John Malalas,	Chronography 10
TF	John Salisbury,	Polycraticus 2.9
TF	John Zonoras,	Epitome of History
TF	Josephus,	Antiquities 18.3.3 (63-64)
John the Baptist in Josephus	Josephus,	Antiquities 18.5.2 (116-119)
Ananus tries & executes James, brother of Jesus called christ	Josephus,	Antiquities 20.9.1 (200-203)
Ananus speaks to city inhabitants to reject the Zealots	Josephus,	Jewish War 4.162-193
Jesus, 2nd priest in command after Ananus, speaks to the idumeans to dissuade them from trying to enter the city	Josephus,	Jewish War 4.238-270
After Jesus' speech, a severe storm is a omen of coming destruction	Josephus,	Jewish War 4.286-288
Idumeans, after entering city with help of the Zealots, kill all the Chief Priests they can find and mock dead Ananus & Jesus the 2nd in Command, and Jos blames destruction of city on his death	Josephus,	Jewish War 4.315-320
Jesus Christ, Christians named after him, his nature	Justin Martyr,	Apology 1.12.9-11; 1.13.3.
TF	Michael Glycas,	Annals
TF	Michael the Syrian,	Chronicle (Syriac)
TF	Oecumenius,	Commentary on the Apocalypse 88
Ancientness of the Judeans per Josephus	Origen,	Against Celsus 1.16.
John the Baptist in Josephus	Origen,	Against Celsus 1.47a
Josephus attributes destruction of city to death of James the Just, but he should have attributed it to death of Jesus Christ	Origen,	Against Celsus 1.47b-d
James the Just's death reason for destruction of Jerusalem per Josephus, but should have been Jesus,	Origen,	Against Celsus 2.13
Josephus attributes destruction of city to death of James the Just, but he should have attributed it to death of Christ our God	Origen,	Against Celsus 2.13
Moses more ancient than the philosophers per Josephus	Origen,	Against Celsus 4.11.
Jesus' Brothes & Sisters	Origen,	Commentary on Matthew 10.17
Josephus attributes destruction of city to death of James the Just, but he should have attributed it to death of Jesus Christ	Origen,	Commentary on Matthew 10.17
Josephus attributes destruction of city to death of James the Just, but he should have attributed it to death of Jesus Christ	Origen,	Commentary on Matthew 13.55
TF	Peter Comestor	Scholastic History (Latin)
James the brother of the Lord executed by Ananus	Photius,	Bibliotheca 238
TF	Pseudo-Gregory of Nyssa,	On the Cognition of God
TF summarized & Jesus said to be confessed as God by principal men of the Synagogue by Josephus	Pseudo-Hegesippus,	On the Downfall of Jerusalem 2.12
TF	Sozomen,	History of the Church 1.1.5.
TF	Suda,	Lexicon, iota 503
TF	Symeon Logothetes,	Chronicon 59
Christ author of name Christians punished by Pontius Pilate	Tacitus,	Annals 15.44.
Christ as Just and Good man, per Josephus, showing well signs of omens	Unknown	Religious Dialogue at the Sassanid Court

These are the passages for which I have a Greek and/or Latin text to match to a more-or-less modern English translation. Yes, many come from your very own Text Excavation site! I will see if there are any corrections to come from board members before compiling a master file of all of them (English, Greek, Latin, sorry no Syriac or Arabic).

DCH

[Ken Olson]

David,

Thanks for this. I've found your and Ben's compilations of the different versions of the Testimonium handy. Just a couple of comments:

(1) You might add the sixth century Latin translation of the Antiquities commissioned by Cassiodorus, which is what most later Latin writers (like Peter Comestor) used. David Levenson and Thomas Martin recently published a critical text of the Testimonium from the Latin Antiquities in the Journal for the Study of Judaism 45 (2014) 1-79.

(2) Roger Pearse has put a translation of the Religious Discussion at the Court of the Sassanids online here:

http://www.tertullian.org/fathers/anony ... sprach.htm

The translator says he has followed the "long recension." I haven't checked what the printed critical editions say, but judging from the immediate context in which the Testimonium is located, Whiston's Anastasius Abbas contr. Jud. (= Pseudo-Anastasius of Sinai's Disputatio adversus Ioudaeos, CPG 7772) seems to be a different recension of the same work.

(3) I think there's another Greek witness in Leo the Wise, but I can't provide details at the moment.


Best,

Ken

[Ben C. Smith]

(1) You might add the sixth century Latin translation of the Antiquities commissioned by Cassiodorus, which is what most later Latin writers (like Peter Comestor) used. David Levenson and Thomas Martin recently published a critical text of the Testimonium from the Latin Antiquities in the Journal for the Study of Judaism 45 (2014) 1-79.

Good point. One of the manuscripts for the Latin Antiquities is online here: http://www.bavarikon.de/object/bav:SBB- ... 4?cq=&p=-1. The relevant text looks like this:



Peter Kirby has a transcription here: http://peterkirby.com/the-latin-testimo ... ebius.html (note: his transcription is of the Latin version, not of this manuscript in particular). Here is my quick transcription of this manuscript (all nomina sacra and other abbreviations filled out, and all consonantal instances of the letter u turned into v for ease of reading):

Fuit autem hisdem temporibus Ihesus sapiens vir, si tamen virum eum nominare fas est. Erat enim mirabilium operum effector et doctor hominum eorum qui libenter audiunt quae vera sunt. Et multos quidem Iudaeorum multos etiam ex gentibus sibi adiunxit. Christus hic erat. Hunc accusatione primorum nostrae gentis virorum cum Pilatus in crucem agendum esse decrevisset, non deseruerunt hi qui ab initio eum dilexerant. Apparuit enim eis tertio die, iterum vivus, secundum quod divinitus inspirati prophetae, vel haec vel alia de eo innumera miracula futura esse praedixerant. Sed et in <h>odiernum Christianorum, qui ab ipso nuncupati sunt, et nomen perseverat et genus.

I think there's another Greek witness in Leo the Wise, but I can't provide details at the moment.

I would be interested in seeing that.

[Ken Olson]

Whoops! I wrote:

(1) You might add the sixth century Latin translation of the Antiquities commissioned by Cassiodorus, which is what most later Latin writers (like Peter Comestor) used. David Levenson and Thomas Martin recently published a critical text of the Testimonium from the Latin Antiquities in the Journal for the Study of Judaism 45 (2014) 1-79.

I should have mentioned that Cassiodorus' group actually re-used the Latin translation of the Testimonium from Rufinus' translation of Eusebius' Ecclesiastical History (which Ben already has in his compilation).

[Ben C. Smith]

Whoops! I wrote:

(1) You might add the sixth century Latin translation of the Antiquities commissioned by Cassiodorus, which is what most later Latin writers (like Peter Comestor) used. David Levenson and Thomas Martin recently published a critical text of the Testimonium from the Latin Antiquities in the Journal for the Study of Judaism 45 (2014) 1-79.

I should have mentioned that Cassiodorus' group actually re-used the Latin translation of the Testimonium from Rufinus' translation of Eusebius' Ecclesiastical History (which Ben already has in his compilation).

Well, yes, Cassiodorus did reuse Rufinus... with only the most minor modifications. But it is good to have him on the list nonetheless, especially given (as you point out) the direct influence he had on Western medieval writers.

[Ken Olson]

I wrote:

I think there's another Greek witness in Leo the Wise, but I can't provide details at the moment.

That should have been Leo Grammaticus (historian), not Leo the Wise (emperor and writer). It may take a while to track down. I don't seem t have full access to the TLG at the moment.

[Ben C. Smith]

I wrote:

I think there's another Greek witness in Leo the Wise, but I can't provide details at the moment.

That should have been Leo Grammaticus (historian), not Leo the Wise (emperor and writer). It may take a while to track down. I don't seem t have full access to the TLG at the moment.

Found it on Google Books.

[Ben C. Smith]

Found it on Google Books.

A digital transcription:

Ἔτι κατὰ τοῦτον τὸν καὶρον ἤν Ἰησοῦς, σοφὸς ἀνήρ, εἴ γε αὐτὸν ἄνδρα λέγειν χρή· ἦν γὰρ παραδόξων ἔργων ποιητής καὶ διδάσκαλος ἀνθρώπων τῶν ἐν ἡδονῇ τὰ ἀληθῆ δεχομένων, πολλοὺς γὰρ καὶ ἀπὸ Ἑλλήνων ἠγάγετο· ὁ Χριστὸς οὗτος ἦν, ὅν Πιλάτος σταυρώσας. οὐκ ἐξεπαύσαντο οἱ τὸ πρῶτον αὐτὸν ἀγαπήσαντες· ἐφάνη γὰρ αὐτοῖς τῇ τρίτῃ ἡμέρᾳ πάλιν ζῶν, τῶν θείων προφητῶν ταῦτά τε καὶ ἄλλα μυρία περὶ αὐτοῦ θαυμάσια εἰρηκότων.

This version appears to lack anything corresponding to the final sentence, εἰς ἔτι τε νῦν τῶν Χριστιανῶν ἀπὸ τοῦδε ὠνομασμένον οὐκ ἐπέλιπε τὸ φῦλον.

[Ken Olson]

Wow! That was fast work. It seems to lack mention of Jews as well, either as followers or accusers.