According To "John" About How Old Was Jesus When He Died?

[outhouse]

You know that the average Canadian is far better educated than the average American. .

Yes I have seen their intellect in a hockey rink.


Really its non sequitur. Its not hard to surpass typical Americans who are warm enough to enjoy the outdoors.


All that indoor time you get, one would suspect your work should be inline with the most educated instead of being in Stephans own little world.

[Secret Alias]

Your lack in your foreign intellect here is exposed.

Wow. There's another testimony to the failure of American education. Just look that sentence structure in the middle of a debate about your writing skills and comprehension ability.

[outhouse]

accepting that every text that was preserved in the Church or their scribes is 100% accurate (except for all the spiritual mumbo jumbo which you don't agree with because your an atheist)).

Very ignorant on your part, as your desperation Is obvious in that you have to attack those with credible views spouting these lies you cannot back up.

Provide one thread of mine that could be used in example of the above, YOU cannot because your a desperate liar.

Making sense of early Christian origins involves more than merely 'lopping off' all the references to Jesus being a God.

See your a desperate liar, as I have never stooped to a methodology that weak.


Nor can you provide examples showing any honesty on your part.

[outhouse]

You have always been a very poor debater.


Irenaeus doesn't work out the consequences of his opinion. If Jesus lives to be nearly 50, then what are the dates of his birth and death? Irenaeus himself (3.21) says Jesus was born about the forty-first year of the reign of Augustus, i.e., 3/2 BC. That puts his death at nearly AD 48, which produces some serious problem vis-a-vis Pauline chronology.

SO YOUR BS raises more questions then answers

[Secret Alias]

Nor can you provide examples showing any honesty on your part.

What kind of 'examples' would show my 'honesty'?

So people who disagree with you 'lack honesty'? Maybe I misjudged your misuse of 'rhetoric.' Maybe you believe that understanding antiquity is 'real simple' and all those sophisticated arguments out made by fancy intellectuals (= people smarter than you) are 'just rhetoric' coming from the mouths of dishonest eggheads who know that Jesus was just a 'peasant revolutionary' but like to 'make up stuff' to show how smart they are - itself a kind of rural backwater American POV. But even if you believe that it would just show the fact that you're really a wretched person who can't believe that people can come to different conclusions from the same evidence and still be engaging the subject 'honestly.' I really, really don't believe that Jesus was a peasant revolutionary. Honestly.

[outhouse]

So people who disagree with you 'lack honesty'?

.

Shut up.

Provide examples

accepting that every text that was preserved in the Church or their scribes is 100% accurate (except for all the spiritual mumbo jumbo which you don't agree with because your an atheist)).

Or admit your a filthy liar.

[outhouse]

I really, really don't believe that Jesus was a peasant revolutionary. Honestly.

You don't believe much of credible academia.

Your belief, I have no issue with. It is the certainty you demand others follow.

from the mouths of dishonest eggheads who know that Jesus was just a 'peasant revolutionary' but like to 'make up stuff' to show how smart they are -

BS.

There is a reason why a Galilean was martyred, regardless of his historicity.


And if you fail to understand the context of the debated socioeconomics, you will NEVER understand why a Galilean was FACTUALLY martyred.

[outhouse]

Irenaeus doesn't work out the consequences of his opinion. If Jesus lives to be nearly 50, then what are the dates of his birth and death? Irenaeus himself (3.21) says Jesus was born about the forty-first year of the reign of Augustus, i.e., 3/2 BC. That puts his death at nearly AD 48, which produces some serious problem vis-a-vis Pauline chronology.

SO the real debate here is only why did he write what he did.

And by looking at his Christology, knowing he is combatting heresy, it is a safe assumption simply that he is promoting that wise teachers are older then 30. That's is the CONTEXT here.

[JoeWallack]

The Paradox

JW:
I may regret posting this but as Doc said in the classic Back To The Future, "I just figured what the hell."

The evil and wicked Tertullian sez that the census which supports HJ (human Jesus) was Sentius Saturninus (SS). Christian
commentators generally connect this to "Luke's" infancy narrative. SS was governor of Syria 9-7 BCE..
Jesus' supposed death is commonly dated to 33 CE. If Tertullian intended to connect the supposed census in GLuke to SS
then he would be support that Jesus could have been as old as 42 (which, according to HGG, is the answer to The Question).
Tertullian, like Irenaeus of Lyons (yes, "Lyons"), is much closer to GJohn than the Synoptics, and like Irenaeus, favored it over
the Synoptics.

I think Dr. Carrier is correct though in pointing out that the context of Tertullian's offending comment did not refer to the
Lukan census/Jesus directly but instead referred to Jesus' supposed relatives/ancestors (if Jesus had human relatives/ancestors
than Jesus' human relatives/ancestors were related to a human Jesus). The title of the work is Against Marcion after all:

IV.19 ADVERSUS MARCIONEM 363

Tell me, does everybody who has been
born, have a mother still living? Does everybody who has been
born, have brothers born to him as well? Is it not more likely
that people have their fathers living or their sisters, or even no
one? Also it is well known that a census had just been taken in
Judaea by Sentius Saturninus, and they might have inquired of
his ancestry in those records.2

I do think GJohn supports his Jesus being fiftyish and not to think so by being unduly influenced by the Synoptics is
anachronistic but I don't think Tertullian is support for this Thread.


Joseph

So much time, so little messiah - Christianity

The New Porphyry

[Secret Alias]

This reference to a census or birth rolls appears in other works of Tertullian