Nazareth, Nazara, Nazarenes, and Nazoreans.

[Clive]

But ... offside rule?

[Peter Kirby]

I'd like to add some data from other sources to this thead:

http://peterkirby.com/self-identifications.html

There I identified Hippolytus of Rome, Tertullian, the Acts of Peter, and the Apocryphon of John as witnesses to the term (Nazarene)--in addition to Acts and the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, and Philip.

The Hippolytus (and pseudo-Hippolytus) quotes aren't anything much, really.

Hippolytus Scr. Eccl., Demonstratio adversus Judaeos [Sp.]
Page 19, line 4

<Πρὸς Ἰουδαίους ἀποδεικτική>

Οὐκοῦν κλῖνον τὸ οὖς σου ἐμοὶ καὶ εἰσάκουσον τῶν ῥημάτων μου
καὶ πρόσεχε, ὦ Ἰουδαῖε· σὺ δὲ πολλάκις ἐκκαυχώμενος ὅτι τὸν Ἰη-
σοῦν τὸν Ναζωραῖον θανάτωι κατέκρινας καὶ ὄξος καὶ χολὴν αὐτὸν
ἐπότισας, καὶ σεμνύνηι ἐπὶ τούτωι.

Now, then, incline thine ear to me, and hear my words, and give heed, thou Jew. Many a time dost thou boast thyself, in that thou didst condemn Jesus of Nazareth to death, and didst give Him vinegar and gall to drink; and thou dost vaunt thyself because of this. Come therefore, and let us consider together whether perchance thou dost not boast unrighteously, O Israel, (and) whether that small portion of vinegar and gall has not brought down this fearful threatening upon thee, (and) whether this is not the cause of thy present condition involved in these myriad troubles.

Hippolytus Scr. Eccl., Contra haeresin Noeti
Chapter 18, section 7, line 2

οὗτος στεφανοῦται κατὰ διαβόλου, οὗτός ἐστιν Ἰης-
οῦς ὁ Ναζωραῖος, ὁ ἐν Κανὰ ἐν γάμοις κληθεὶς καὶ τὸ
ὕδωρ εἰς οἶνον μεταβαλῶν, καὶ θαλάσσῃ ὑπὸ βίας ἀνέμων
κινουμένῃ ἐπιτιμῶν, καὶ ἐπὶ θαλάσσης περιπατῶν ὡς
ἐπὶ ξηρᾶς γῆς, καὶ τυφλὸν ἐκ γενετῆς ὁρᾶν ποιῶν, καὶ
νεκρὸν Λάζαρον τετραήμερον ἀνιστῶν, καὶ ποικίλας
δυνάμεις ἀποτελῶν, καὶ ἁμαρτίας ἀφίων, καὶ ἐξουσίαν
διδῶν μαθηταῖς, καὶ αἷμα καὶ ὕδωρ ἐξ ἁγίας πλευρᾶς
ῥεύσας λόγχῃ νυγείς.

He is crowned victor against the devil. This is Jesus of Nazareth, who was invited to the marriage-feast in Cana, and turned the water into wine, and rebuked the sea when agitated by the violence of the winds, and walked on the deep as on dry land, and caused the blind man from birth to see, and raised Lazarus to life after he had been dead four days, and did many mighty works, and forgave sins, and conferred power on the disciples, and had blood and water flowing from His sacred side when pierced with the spear. For His sake the sun is darkened, the day has no light, the rocks are shattered, the veil is rent, the foundations of the earth are shaken, the graves are opened, and the dead are raised, and the rulers are ashamed when they see the Director of the universe upon the cross closing His eye and giving up the ghost. Creation saw, and was troubled; and, unable to bear the sight of His exceeding glory, shrouded itself in darkness.

Note, in any case, the tendency of English translators to substitute "Jesus of Nazareth."

Tertullian has an additional reference (to the one quoted from him above):

http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/t ... ian21.html

Accordingly, all thereafter who became believers used to be baptized. Then it was, too, that Paul, when he believed, was baptized; and this is the meaning of the precept which the Lord had given him when smitten with the plague of loss of sight, saying, "Arise, and enter Damascus; there shall be demonstrated to thee what thou oughtest to do," to wit--be baptized, which was the only thing lacking to him. That point excepted, he bad sufficiently learnt and believed "the Nazarene" to be "the Lord, the Son of God." [crediderat Nazarenum esse dominum dei filium]

But they roll back an objection from that apostle himself, in that he said, "For Christ sent me not to baptize;", as if by this argument baptism were done away! For if so, why did he baptize Gaius, and Crispus, and the house of Stephanas?

This seems to tie in with the statements of Irenaeus about the idea of the baptism of the "visible Jesus" being different from the redemption of Christ.

Here are the Acts of Peter.

Peter began to say with a loud voice...

Turn yourselves, therefore, brethren, chosen of the Lord, and be strong in God Almighty, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, whom no man hath seen at any time, neither can see, save he who hath believed in him. And be ye aware whence this temptation hath come upon you. For it is not only by words that I would convince you that this is Christ whom I preach, but also by deeds and exceeding great works of power do I exhort you by the faith that is in Christ Jesus, that none of you look for any other save him that was despised and mocked of the Jews, even this Nazarene which was crucified and died and the third day rose again.

Nothing too exciting in these quotes, really, but here they are.

Possibly notable by way of omission: Although Clement of Alexandria has a good-sized body of work, there's no Nazarene in the extent Clement. (Then again, given the texts that Clement accepts in the New Testament, I have no idea what's notable about it, so... more notable, though, is the absence in Paul and other early texts.)

[Peter Kirby]

There is some information from the Talmud.

[wiki]Nazarene (title)[/wiki]

"Nazarene" and "Nazarenes" in the Talmud

The first Hebrew language mentions of Notzri (singular) and Notzrim (plural) are in manuscripts of the Babylonian Talmud, these mentions are not found in the Jerusalem Talmud.[52] Notzrim are not mentioned in older printed editions of the Talmud due to Christian censorship of Jewish presses.[53] Notzrim are clearly mentioned in Avodah Zarah 6a, Ta'anit 27b, and may be reconstructed in other texts such as Gittin 57a.[54]
Avodah Zarah ("foreign worship") 6a: "The Nazarene day, according to the words of R. Ishmael, is forbidden for ever"[55]
Taanit "On fasting" 27b: "Why did they not fast on the day after the Sabbath? Rabbi Johanan said, because of the Notzrim"
Samuel Klein (1909)[56] proposed that the passage in Gittin ("Documents") 57a, which is one of the most controversial possible references to Jesus in the Talmud, may also have included reference to "Yesu ha Notzri" warning his followers, the "Notzrim", of his and their fate.[57]
An additional possible reference in the Tosefta where the text may have originally read Notzrim ("Christians") rather than Mitzrim ("Egyptians")[58] is "They said: He went to hear him from Kfar Sakhnia[59] of the Egyptians [Mitzrim] to the west." where medical aid from a certain Jacob, or James, is avoided.[60]
There are no Tannaitic references to "Notzrim" and few from the Amoraic period.[61] References by Tannaim (70-200 CE) and Amoraim (230-500 CE) to "Minim" are much more common, leading some, such as R. Travers Herford (1903), to conclude that Minim in Talmud and Midrash generally refers to Jewish Christians.[62]

Yeshu ha Notzri
Main article: Jesus in the Talmud

The references to Notzrim in the Babylonian Talmud are related to the meaning and person of Yeshu Ha Notzri ("Jesus the Nazarene") in the Talmud and Tosefta.[53] This includes passages in the Babylonian Talmud such as Sanhedrin 107b which states "Jesus the Nazarene practiced magic and led Israel astray" though scholars such as Bock (2002) consider the historicity of the event described is questionable.[63][64] The Jerusalem Talmud contains other coded references to Jesus such as "Jesus ben Pantera,"[65] while the references using the term notzri are restricted to the Babylon Talmud.[66][67] (See main article Jesus in the Talmud for further discussion).

[spin]

And Jews, Sramans (Buddhists), Brahmins, Nasoreans, Christians, Maktak (Baptisers), and Zandiks (Manichaeans)

For the sake of accuracy & the reduction of assumptions, the Kartir inscription doesn't have the form "Nasoreans". According to Neusner (History of the Jews in Babylonia, II, 73), it does have N`ČR`Y (where Č is presumably similar to Hebrew tsade). The forms given in English are all interpretations including "Nasoreans" (which Neusner gives as Sprengling's translation p.18) and "Nazaréens" (Neusner citing Chaumont's translation).

[spin]

One more thing. שרר most commonly means 'power, might' in Samaritan Aramaic https://books.google.com/books?id=6K-9C ... el&f=false. The truth is powerful.

It's just a jump to the left.
And a step to the right.
Put your hands on your hips,
And bring your knees in tight.
But it's the pelvic thrust...

[spin]

There is some information from the Talmud.

[wiki]Nazarene (title)[/wiki]

"Nazarene" and "Nazarenes" in the Talmud

The first Hebrew language mentions of Notzri (singular) and Notzrim (plural) are in manuscripts of the Babylonian Talmud, these mentions are not found in the Jerusalem Talmud.[52] Notzrim are not mentioned in older printed editions of the Talmud due to Christian censorship of Jewish presses.[53] Notzrim are clearly mentioned in Avodah Zarah 6a, Ta'anit 27b, and may be reconstructed in other texts such as Gittin 57a.[54]
Avodah Zarah ("foreign worship") 6a: "The Nazarene day, according to the words of R. Ishmael, is forbidden for ever"[55]
Taanit "On fasting" 27b: "Why did they not fast on the day after the Sabbath? Rabbi Johanan said, because of the Notzrim"
Samuel Klein (1909)[56] proposed that the passage in Gittin ("Documents") 57a, which is one of the most controversial possible references to Jesus in the Talmud, may also have included reference to "Yesu ha Notzri" warning his followers, the "Notzrim", of his and their fate.[57]
An additional possible reference in the Tosefta where the text may have originally read Notzrim ("Christians") rather than Mitzrim ("Egyptians")[58] is "They said: He went to hear him from Kfar Sakhnia[59] of the Egyptians [Mitzrim] to the west." where medical aid from a certain Jacob, or James, is avoided.[60]
There are no Tannaitic references to "Notzrim" and few from the Amoraic period.[61] References by Tannaim (70-200 CE) and Amoraim (230-500 CE) to "Minim" are much more common, leading some, such as R. Travers Herford (1903), to conclude that Minim in Talmud and Midrash generally refers to Jewish Christians.[62]

I went through the Notzri/m references in Rabbinical writings by myself, concluding similar dates which indicates that the use of Notzri/m can't be linked to anything earlier than the early 3rd century, ie all the stuff about the Birkat ha-Minim (and its 9th century Cairo manuscript reference to Notzrim) connection with Jn 16:2 (and being thrown out of synagogues) is pure wishful thinking. The significance of the earliest dating for Jewish comments concerning Notzrim (which by appearances means "watchmen/watchers") does not permit the use of Notzrim as a source for any of the terms in the title of this thread.