Re: Wiki EarlyChristian writings Missing from our Forum'sWeb
Posted: Sat Apr 29, 2017 6:40 am
Thanks, Ben.
Investigating the roots of western civilization (ye olde BC&H forum of IIDB lives on...)
https://earlywritings.com/forum/
There's no such implication.rakovsky wrote:like there being two separate texts?
Erroneously attributed to the Jewish historian since at least the 9th century, it is now believed to be (at least in its original form) the work of Hippolytus of Rome.
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This brief discourse, at least in its original form, is now attributed to the church father Hippolytus.[4] The attribution to Josephus, recorded by Photius in his Bibliotheca,[3] did not stand unchallenged even in antiquity, and the "Discourse" was also ascribed to Caius, Presbyter of Rome, Justin Martyr, and Irenaeus.[5]
We now know that a work by Hippolytus published in Vol. 5 of the Ante-Nicene Fathers under the title "Against Plato, on the Cause of the Universe" is essentially the same work as the "Discourse" attributed to Josephus.[6] This Hippolytus work is in fact a fragment from a longer treatise entitled "Against the Greeks."[7] There are, however, some slight differences between the Hippolytus version and the one that has passed under Josephus' name, notably in the final "Josephus" paragraph. This includes the "In whatsoever ways I shall find you" quote mentioned above, which is not in Hippolytus' fragment as given in the Ante-Nicene Fathers but does appear in Justin Martyr's Dialogue with Trypho (chapter 47), where it is also attributed to Jesus.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus% ... ning_Hades
During the Renaissance a large seated statue of Hippolytus was found, in two pieces, above the catacomb where Hippolytus was supposedly buried. How did they know it was him? On the back was a list of books by this person, and around the base the dates for Easter for 200 years, beginning around 225 A.D. The list is very similar to the list in Eusebius (who devotes about a paragraph to Hippolytus), but had more books. Among those listed was the Refutation of All Heresies and On the Essence [or Cause] of the Universe. So they figured out it was Hippolytus, by way of reading Eusebius, but all they had by Hippolytus were fragments, quotes.
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When Whiston translated Josephus, the fragment of "On the Essence of the Universe" was available in, what, four Greek manuscripts? Whiston brings them together in his book. So why did he attribute this to Josephus? Because at the top of one or more of these manuscripts (copies of copies of copies, of course), it is attributed to "Iosepe" (Greek). Why? Who knows?
http://www.josephus.org/FlJosephus2/Mai ... #discourse
Thank you.