The Thing that Puzzles Me the Most in Patristic Literature

[stephan happy huller]

The prevalence of what we might called 'centonized' scriptural citations in early Fathers. Take this example from Origen's Commentary. It starts and ends with 1 Corinthians but then a passage from Romans seems to be thrust into the discussion without Origen telling his hearers 'hey, I am switching out from Corinthians for a moment':

Indeed even one of the Corinthians to whom Paul declared that he knew nothing but Jesus Christ and Him crucified, should he learn Him who for our sakes became man, and so receive Him, he would become identified with the beginning of the good things we have spoken of; by the man Jesus he would be made a man of God, and by His death he would die to sin. For "Christ, Romans 6:10 in that He died, died unto sin once." But from His life, since "in that He lives, He lives unto God," every one who is conformed to His resurrection receives that living to God. But who will deny that righteousness, essential righteousness, is a good , and essential sanctification, and essential redemption ? And these things those preach who preach Jesus , saying 1 Corinthians 1:30 that He is made to be of God righteousness and sanctification and redemption . Hence we shall have writings about Him without number, showing that Jesus is a multitude of goods ; for from the things which can scarcely be numbered and which have been written we may make some conjecture of those things which actually exist in Him in whom "it pleased God that the whole fullness of the Godhead should dwell bodily," and which are not contained in writings.

But in the very same section when Origen speaks about Isaiah he does not 'switch out' into another prophetic book from the same collection:

But the Apostles , whose feet were beautiful, and those imitators of them who sought to preach the good tidings, could not have done so had not Jesus Himself first preached the good tidings to them, as Isaiah says: Isaiah 52:6 "I myself that speak am here, as the opportunity on the mountains, as the feet of one preaching tidings of peace, as one preaching good things; for I will make My salvation to be heard, saying, God shall reign over you, O Zion!" For what are the mountains on which the speaker declares that He Himself is present, but those who are less than none of the highest and the greatest of the earth? And these must be sought by the able ministers of the New Covenant , in order that they may observe the injunction which says: Isaiah 40:9 Go up into a high mountain, you that preachest good tidings to Zion; you that preachest good tidings to Jerusalem , lift up your voice with strength! Now it is not wonderful if to those who are to preach good tidings Jesus Himself preaches good tidings of good things, which are no other than Himself; for the Son of God preaches the good tidings of Himself to those who cannot come to know Him through others.

I find this so utterly puzzling and consistent throughout at all the early Alexandrian sources (Clement) that it makes me wonder whether the orthodox collection of Paul's letters 'jumbled' material from separate letters in the heretical canon - i.e. whether what here appears as 'Romans' to us was really in 1 Corinthians or the equivalent in the heretical canon.

I read the original reference from '1 Corinthians' as almost speaking in Valentinian terms (see Nag Hammadi Valentinian exposition, Irenaeus etc) where Jesus and Christ are two different entities and Origen is referencing "the man Jesus" (τοῦ ἀνθρώπου Ἰησοῦ) became man through initiating a mortal man (= Christ) into divinity - or as Origen puts it ἄνθρωπος γινόμενος θεοῦ.

Indeed the whole English translation to me is inaccurate above. Origen says:

«ἐν ἀρχῇ» τῶν ἀγαθῶν γίνεται, ὑπὸ τοῦ ἀνθρώπου Ἰησοῦ ἄνθρωπος γινόμενος θεοῦ καὶ ἀπὸ τοῦ θανάτου αὐτοῦ ἀποθνῄσκων τῇ ἁμαρτίᾳ

he would become identified with the beginning of the good things we have spoken of; by the man Jesus he would be made a man of God, and by His death he would die to sin

If we go a little further in the original passage:

Indeed even one of the Corinthians to whom Paul declared that he knew nothing but Jesus Christ and Him crucified, should he learn Him who for our sakes became man, and so receive Him, he would become identified with the beginning of the good things we have spoken of; by the man Jesus he would be made a man of God, and by His death he would die to sin. For "Christ, Romans 6:10 in that He died, died unto sin once." But from His life, since "in that He lives, He lives unto God," every one who is conformed to His resurrection receives that living to God.

Πλὴν κἂν Κορίνθιός τις ὤν, κρίνοντος Παύλου μηδὲν εἰδέναι παρ' αὐτῷ ἢ «Ἰησοῦν Χριστὸν καὶ τοῦτον ἐσταυρωμένον», τὸν δι' ἡμᾶς ἄνθρωπον μανθάνων παραδέξηται, «ἐν ἀρχῇ» τῶν ἀγαθῶν γίνεται, ὑπὸ τοῦ ἀνθρώπου Ἰησοῦ «ἄνθρωπος» γινόμενος «θεοῦ» καὶ ἀπὸ τοῦ θανάτου αὐτοῦ ἀποθνῄσκων τῇ ἁμαρτίᾳ· καὶ γὰρ ἐκεῖνος «ὃ ἀπέθανε, τῇ ἁμαρτίᾳ ἀπέθανεν ἐφάπαξ». Ἀπὸ δὲ τῆς ζωῆς αὐτοῦ, ἐπεὶ Ἰησοῦς «ὃ ζῇ, ζῇ τῷ θεῷ», πᾶς ὁ σύμμορφος γενόμενος τῆς ἀναστάσεως αὐτοῦ λαμβάνει τὸ ζῆν τῷ θεῷ.

I think this is an echo of the longer version of the gospel of Mark criticized (or rejected by Irenaeus in Book Three of Adv Haer:

Those, again, who separate Jesus from Christ, alleging that Christ remained impassible, but that it was Jesus who suffered, preferring the Gospel by Mark

Yes the names have been inverted - i.e. Irenaeus consistently speaks of 'Jesus' having 'Christ' come on him but that is a demonstrable tactic of Irenaeus. The Valentinian exposition demonstrates it was really the other way around (i.e. Jesus the heavenly man and Christ the mortal man initiated or 'enveloped' as the Valentinian Exposition says).

Why does this reference to Secret Mark appear in Comm on John? Well notice that just before Origen speaks about a 'secret gospel':

We must not, however, forget that the sojourning of Christ with men took place before His bodily sojourn, in an intellectual fashion, to those who were more perfect and not children, and were not under pedagogues and governors. In their minds they saw the fullness of the time to be at hand— the patriarchs , and Moses the servant, and the prophets who beheld the glory of Christ. And as before His manifest and bodily coming He came to those who were perfect , so also, after His coming has been announced to all, to those who are still children, since they are under pedagogues and governors and have not yet arrived at the fullness of the time , forerunners of Christ have come to sojourn, discourses (logoi) suited for minds still in their childhood, and rightly, therefore, termed pedagogues . But the Son Himself, the glorified God, the Word , has not yet come; He waits for the preparation which must take place on the part of men of God who are to admit His deity . And this, too, we must bear in mind, that as the law contains a shadow of good things to come, which are indicated by that law which is announced according to truth, so the Gospel also teaches a shadow of the mysteries of Christ, the Gospel which is thought to be capable of being understood by any one. What John calls the eternal Gospel, and what may properly be called the spiritual Gospel, presents clearly to those who have the will to understand, all matters concerning the very Son of God, both the mysteries presented by His discourses and those matters of which His acts were the enigmas. In accordance with this we may conclude that, as it is with Him who is a Jew outwardly and circumcised in the flesh, so it is with the Christian and with baptism. Paul and Peter were, at an earlier period, Jews outwardly and circumcised, but later they received from Christ that they should be so in secret, too; so that outwardly they were Jews for the sake of the salvation of many, and by an economy they not only confessed in words that they were Jews, but showed it by their actions . And the same is to be said about their Christianity. As Paul could not benefit those who were Jews according to the flesh, without, when reason shows it to be necessary , circumcising Timothy , and when it appears the natural course getting himself shaved and making a vow , and, in a word, being to the Jews a Jew that he might gain the Jews— so also it is not possible for one who is responsible for the good of many to operate as he should by means of that Christianity only which is in secret. That will never enable him to improve those who are following the external Christianity, or to lead them on to better and higher things. We must, therefore, be Christians both somatically and spiritually, and where there is a call for the somatic (bodily) Gospel, in which a man says to those who are carnal that he knows nothing but Jesus Christ and Him crucified, so we must do. But should we find those who are perfected in the spirit , and bear fruit in it, and are enamoured of the heavenly wisdom, these must be made to partake of that Word which, after it was made flesh, rose again to what it was in the beginning, with God.

There is some connection between John and secret Mark. I just can't put my finger on it yet.

[Blood]

It seems like everything in Hullerean Reconstruction of Early Christianity is a Venn Diagram with Mar Saba 56 in the mystic center.

[stephan happy huller]

If Moses wrote another book I think that would qualify as "significant." If its not true that's significant too

[A_Nony_Mouse]

How about Origen was an idiot?

Or to that effect. It is improper to examine religious texts with the assumption that failure to understand is the fault of the examiner not the author.

[stephan happy huller]

Why even contribute that meaningless comment. It doesn't even make sense in the context of the thread

[Peter Kirby]

Perhaps relevant is the canonical status of the New Testament in relation to the canonical status of the Septuagint. People sometimes equate canonical status with books being read in the churches. That might be, but it's possible that God's Word for His People (translated into Greek) was given different treatment from the notes of the apostles. I get the general impression that the books of the Septuagint were held in higher esteem than they are by Christians today, in any case. Christians today make apologetic arguments from the reliability of the apostles, while in the ancient world the focus was on the prophetic words about Christ in the scriptures (i.e., the Septuagint).

In any case, you're right; it's definitely a phenomenon to consider.

[stephan happy huller]

Another example from the second part of the Acts of Archelaus (a letter from a certain Diodorus from a church somewhere in Osroene referencing corruption of scripture by Manes allegedly). We read:

Thus, too, on the authority of an apostle, he endeavoured to establish the position that the law of Moses is the law of death, and that the law of Jesus, on the contrary, is the law of life. For he based that assertion on the passage which runs thus: “In which also may God make us able ministers of the New Testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter kills, but the spirit gives life. But if the ministration of death, engraven in letters on the stones, was made in glory, so that the children of Israel could not steadfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away; how shall not the ministration of the Spirit be rather glorious? For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more does the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excels. For if that which shall be done away is glorious, much more that which remains is glorious.” And this passage, as you are also well aware, occurs in the second Epistle to the Corinthians. Besides, he added to this another passage out of the first epistle, on which he based his affirmation that the disciples of the Old Testament were earthly and natural; and in accordance with this, that flesh and blood could not possess the kingdom of God (1 Corinthians 15:50) He also maintained that Paul himself spoke in his own proper person when he said: “If I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.” Further, he averred that the same apostle made this statement most obviously on the subject of the resurrection of the flesh (Acta Arch 40).

The sense here seems to be that 2 Corinthians chapter 2 was fused to the antitheses in 1 Corinthians (i.e. chapter 15). The same thing shows up in Archelaus's response:

I shall speak now with the utmost brevity of the veil of Moses and the ministration of death. For I do not think that these things at least can introduce very much to the disparagement of the law. The text in question, then, proceeds thus: “But if the ministration of death, engraven in letters on the stones, was made in glory, so that the children of Israel could not steadfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away; ” and so on. Well, this passage at any rate acknowledges the existence of a glory on the countenance of Moses, and that surely is a fact favourable to our position. And even although it is to be done away. and although there is a veil in the reading of the same, that does not annoy me or disturb me, provided there be glory in it still. Neither is it the case, that whatever is to be done away is reduced thereby under all manner of circumstances to a condition of dishonour. For when the Scripture speaks of glory, it shows us also that it had cognizance of differences in glory. Thus it says: “There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differs from another star in glory.” Although, then, the sun has a greater glory than the moon, it does not follow that the moon is thereby reduced to a condition of dishonour. And even thus, too, although my Lord Jesus Christ excels Moses in glory, as the lord excels the servant, it does not follow from this that the glory of Moses is to be scorned. For in this way, too, we are able to satisfy our hearers, as the nature of the word itself carries the conviction with it in that we affirm what we allege on the authority of the Scriptures themselves, or verily make the proof of our statements all the clearer also by illustrations taken from them. Thus, although a person kindles a lamp in the night-time, after the sun has once risen he has no further need of the paltry light of his lamp, on account of that effulgence of the sun which sends forth its rays all the world over; and yet, for all that, the man does not throw his lamp contemptuously away, as if it were something absolutely antagonistic to the sun; but rather, when he has once found out its use, he will keep it with all the greater carefulness. Precisely in this way, then, the law of Moses served as a sort of guardian to the people, like the tamp, until the true Sun, who is our Saviour, should arise, even as the apostle also says to us: “And Christ shall give you light.” We must look, however, to what is said further on: “Their minds were blinded: for until this day remains the same veil in the reading of the Old Testament; it is untaken away, because it is done away in Christ. For even unto this day, when Moses is read, the veil is upon their heart. Nevertheless, when it shall turn to the Lord, the veil shall be taken away. Now the Lord is that Spirit.” What, then, is meant by this? Is Moses present with us even unto this day? Is it the case that he has never slept, that he has never gone to his rest, that he has never departed this life? How is it that this phrase “unto this day” is used here? Well, only mark the veil, which is placed, where he says it is placed, on their hearts in their reading. This, therefore, is the word of censure upon the children of Israel, because they read Moses and yet do not understand him, and refuse to turn to the Lord; for it is He that was prophesied of by Moses as about to come. (ibid 43)

[stephan happy huller]

Compare the heretical text:

In which also may God make us able ministers of the New Testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter kills, but the spirit gives life. But if the ministration of death, engraven in letters on the stones, was made in glory, so that the children of Israel could not steadfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away; how shall not the ministration of the Spirit be rather glorious? For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more does the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excels. For if that which shall be done away is glorious, much more that which remains is glorious

I shall speak now with the utmost brevity of the veil of Moses and the ministration of death. For I do not think that these things at least can introduce very much to the disparagement of the law. The text in question, then, proceeds thus: “But if the ministration of death, engraven in letters on the stones, was made in glory, so that the children of Israel could not steadfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away; ” and so on. Well, this passage at any rate acknowledges the existence of a glory on the countenance of Moses, and that surely is a fact favourable to our position. And even although it is to be done away. and although there is a veil in the reading of the same, that does not annoy me or disturb me, provided there be glory in it still.

Their minds were blinded: for until this day remains the same veil in the reading of the Old Testament; it is untaken away, because it is done away in Christ. For even unto this day, when Moses is read, the veil is upon their heart. Nevertheless, when it shall turn to the Lord, the veil shall be taken away. Now the Lord is that Spirit.

And this is the veil which is on Moses; for it was not, as some among the unlearned perhaps fancy, any piece of linen cloth, or any skin that covered his face. But the apostle also takes care to make this plain to us, when he tells us that the veil is put on in the reading of the Old Testament, inasmuch as they who are called Israel from olden time still look for the coming of Christ, and perceive not that the princes have been wanting from Judah, and the leaders from his thighs

to 2 Corinthians:

He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! 10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. 11 And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!

12 Therefore, since we have such a hope, we are very bold. 13 We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to prevent the Israelites from seeing the end of what was passing away. 14 But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away. 15 Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts. 16 But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. 17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. 18 And we all, who with unveiled faces contemplate[a] the Lord’s glory, are being transformed into his image with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit.

[stephan happy huller]

I am pretty sure that this was closing words of the 'antitheses' affixed before the gospel in the Marcionite canon:

... in which also may God make us able ministers of the New Testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter kills, but the spirit gives life. But if the ministration of death, engraven in letters on the stones, was made in glory, so that the children of Israel could not steadfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away; how shall not the ministration of the Spirit be rather glorious? For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more does the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excels. For if that which shall be done away is glorious, much more that which remains is glorious

The splendor of the heavenly bodies is one kind, and the splendor of the earthly bodies is another. There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differs from another star in glory.

Sown in decay, raised in immortality;
Sown in dishonor, raised in glory;
Sown in weakness, raised in power;
Sown a natural body, raised a spiritual body.

The first man Adam became a living being; the last one, the Lord, a life-giving spirit. The spiritual did not come first, but the natural, and after that the spiritual.

The first man was of the dust of the earth; the second man is the Lord of heaven.
As the made of dust, so are those who are of the dust;
as the heavenly man, so also those who are of heaven.
And just as we have borne the image of the one of the dust, let us bear the image of the one of heaven.

This moreover I declare to you, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the decay inherit immortality. Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will all arise, but we will not all be changed. Indeed this perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and this mortal with immortality.

Therefore, since we have such a hope, we are very bold. We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to prevent the Israelites from seeing the end of what was passing away. Their minds were blinded: for until this day remains the same veil in the reading of the Old Testament; it is untaken away, because it is done away in Christ. For even unto this day, when Moses is read, the veil is upon their heart. Nevertheless, when it shall turn to the Lord, the veil shall be taken away. Now the Lord is that Spirit.

Therefore, since we have this ministry as we received mercy, we do not lose heart. Rather, we renounce the hidden shameful things; not walking in craftiness, nor do we falsify the word of God. On the contrary, by manifestation of the truth commend ourselves to the conscience of all men before God. And even if our gospel is hidden, it is kept hidden from those who are perishing. The god of this world has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so as not to shine forth the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. For what we preach is not ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, and ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake.

For God, who said, “out of darkness light will shine,” made his light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of God’s glory displayed in the face of Christ.

[stephan happy huller]

The closing section of De Recta in Deum Fide (Adamantius) supports the integration of the aforementioned section of 2 Corinthians into the "antitheses" section of 1 Corinthians 15:38 - 53. The Latin and Greek recensions differ markedly. Will work on this tonight