Roger Pearse, Origen and the Burning of Marcionite Books

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Roger Pearse, Origen and the Burning of Marcionite Books

Post by Secret Alias » Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:07 pm

“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote

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Re: Roger Pearse, Origen and the Burning of Marcionite Books

Post by Secret Alias » Tue Oct 17, 2017 7:37 pm

It is worth noting that the connection between Korah and Marcion was first established by Irenaeus who said that Marcion said that the Lord descended to Hades to save Cain, Korah, Dathan, Abiram, Esau, and all the nations who had not served the Jewish god. But this can't be the original argument given the context of the story in Numbers. Korah served a Jewish god just as Marcion served a Jewish god. The contention is whether Moses is the sole witness to that god, not the god himself.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote

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Re: Roger Pearse, Origen and the Burning of Marcionite Books

Post by Giuseppe » Wed Oct 18, 2017 5:28 am

The story of the suspect of the right people in Hades about the identity of Jesus seems very much similar to the Gospel story about the scribes who ask to Jesus about his origin (and the Reference to JtB in the answer by Jesus).
Nihil enim in speciem fallacius est quam prava religio. -Liv. xxxix. 16.

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Re: Roger Pearse, Origen and the Burning of Marcionite Books

Post by Secret Alias » Wed Oct 18, 2017 5:47 am

What makes the story interesting is that Origen is NOT suggesting destroying the gospels of the heretics. In fact it suggests the opposite - the censers (= the gospels) are holy and should not be destroyed.
If this case were judged today among men and if an examination were held among the rulers of the churches concerning those who have endured the penalty of divine vengeance, because, for instance, they teach things that are different from the churches, would it not be judged that, whatever they have said, whatever they have taught, whatever they have left behind in writing, all of it should utterly perish equally with their own ashes?

But God’s judgments are not like our judgments. For listen to how he commands the censers of those who have risen up against God’s prophet to be made into beaten plates and to be affixed around the altar.[7] Korah contains a figure of those who rise up against ecclesiastical faith and the teaching of the truth. Thus it is written of Korah and his company that they offered the incense of “strange fire” in bronze censers.[8] God commands the strange fire to be dispersed and poured out, “but the censers,” it says, “since they have been sanctified, make them into beaten plates, and surround the altar with them, since they were offered before the Lord and have been sanctified.”[9]

Well, to me what seems to be shown through this figure is that these censers, which the Scripture calls “bronze,” contain a figure of the divine Scripture. On this Scripture, the heretics place a “strange fire” by introducing a meaning and an interpretation that is estranged from God and contrary to the truth. They do not offer a sweet incense to the Lord, but a detestable kind. And therefore this example [forma] is given to the priests of the churches, that if at some time some such thing should arise, those things that are indeed alien from the truth should be immediately expelled from the church of God.

But if some things from the meanings of the divine Scripture are found inserted into the words even of heretics, let these things not be rejected equally with those things that are contrary to the truth and to the faith.
For those of us who care about Morton Smith's discovery, here at last we have found evidence of how a non-canonical - even a heretical gospel - could have been tolerated in the Alexandrian community.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote

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Re: Roger Pearse, Origen and the Burning of Marcionite Books

Post by Secret Alias » Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:05 am

Another observation. Bronze is a mixture of metals - tin and copper. In the previous passage from Origen we see 'bronze' is associated with the heretical gospel. But notice that in Contra Celsum Book 6 similar language and scriptural citation is employed and 'a mixture of metals' is associated with Mars the fifth place in a ladder of seven planets:
After this, Celsus, desiring to exhibit his learning in his treatise against us, quotes also certain Persian mysteries, where he says: "These things are obscurely hinted at in the accounts of the Persians, and especially in the mysteries of Mithras, which are celebrated amongst them. For in the latter there is a representation of the two heavenly revolutions,--of the movement, viz., of the fixed stars, and of that which take place among the planets, and of the passage of the soul through these. The representation is of the following nature: There is a ladder with lofty gates, and on the top of it an eighth gate. The first gate consists of lead, the second of tin, the third of copper (Chadwick = bronze https://books.google.com/books?id=wsKLI ... te&f=false), the fourth of iron, the fifth of a mixture of metals, the sixth of silver, and the seventh of gold. The first gate they assign to Saturn, indicating by the 'lead' the slowness of this star; the second to Venus, comparing her to the splendour and softness of tin; the third to Jupiter, being firm and solid; the fourth to Mercury, for both Mercury and iron are fit to endure all things, and are money-making and laborious; the fifth to Mars, because, being composed of a mixture of metals, it is varied and unequal; the sixth, of silver, to the Moon; the seventh, of gold, to the Sun,--thus imitating the different colours of the two latter."
Mars is certainly the root of the name Marcus. But the association of the third planet with bronze according to Chadwick is interesting owing to Paul's mention of 'the third heaven.'
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote

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Re: Roger Pearse, Origen and the Burning of Marcionite Books

Post by Secret Alias » Wed Oct 18, 2017 9:26 am

Another interesting thing (I never know if anything I say is actually interesting). The firmament of heaven is often described using the term employed by Celsus even among later Christian authors. So Chrysostom:

But with respect to the sun, God hath made it quite the contrary. For He hath turned his beams toward the earth, and made his light to direct itself downward, all but saying to him by the very shape (of the heavens), “Look downward.—Shine upon men, for thou wert made for them!” The light, indeed, of a candle cannot be made to submit to this; but this star, great and marvellous as it is, bends downward, and looks toward the earth, which is contrary to the nature of fire; owing to the power of Him who hath commanded it. Wouldest thou have me speak of another thing of the like kind? Waters embrace the back of the visible heaven [χαλκοβατῆ δώματα] on all parts; and yet they neither flow down, nor are moved out of their place, although the nature of water is not of this kind.

Eustathius https://books.google.com/books?id=4oMyA ... 22&f=false
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote

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