Thank you Ben. I hoped someone would provide the meaning.Ben C. Smith wrote:That is the passive subjunctive aorist of εὑρίσκω (to find). The sense is: "Let us take heed lest, as it is written, we be found many called but few chosen."Michael BG wrote:Barnabas 4:14 is πολλοὶ κλητοί, ολίγοι δὲ ἐκλεκτοὶ εὑρεθῶμεν.
many called few yet chosen (I couldn’t find a translation for εὑρεθῶμεν)
Thank you Ben. I blame tiredness for my missing what you point out. Therefore it seems to be evidence that the author of Barnabas knew Matthews or Marks gospel.Ben C. Smith wrote: ↑Sun Oct 22, 2017 6:09 pmI wish it were so, but first of all, Mark has ἦλθον ("I came") where Barnabas has ἦλθεν ("he came"), so it is not six identical words. And Matthew's only difference is the intrusion of the γὰρ, which as a postpositive particle has to fall in this position in the clause. So Matthew and Mark are identical with respect to the words which line up with Barnabas. The omission of γὰρ cannot decide the case, since that can happen at any time for any reason in a quote, depending upon the context.Michael BG wrote: ↑Sun Oct 22, 2017 5:45 pmBarnabas is οὐκ ἦλθεν καλέσαι δικαίους, ἀλλὰ ἁμαρτωλούς,
"I came not to call the righteous but sinners,"
Mark 2:17 is οὐκ ἦλθον καλέσαι δικαίους ἀλλὰ ἁμαρτωλούς.
Not I-came to-call the-just-ones but sinners
Matthew 9:13 οὐ γὰρ ἦλθον καλέσαι δικαίους ἀλλὰ ἁμαρτωλούς.
Luke 5:32 οὐκ ἐλήλυθα καλέσαι δικαίους ἀλλὰ ἁμαρτωλοὺς εἰς μετάνοιαν.
Barnabas has six words identical with Mark, but not Matthew and Luke, who both made small changes to Mark. This seems to be evidence that the author of Barnabas knew Mark’s gospel.
I think the gospels were written before the times of Aristides and Quadratus. There are lots of books which existed before my time, but I have not read them and can only quote from those I have access to (in some way).Bernard Muller wrote:Why not?Being aware of the 'things [that also appear] in the gospels and the epistles' is not the same as having access to the gospels and epistles.
Furthermore the internal evidence from the gospels themselves show they were written well before the times of Aristides and Quadratus.
Cordially, Bernard
Perhaps an example would help.
“From a Hebrew virgin”. Both Matthew and Luke have the tradition that Mary was a virgin, but they do not have the same tradition. We can assume that before Matthew and Luke wrote their gospels there was a tradition that Mary was a virgin. It is possible that before this there was a tradition that Jesus’ mother was a virgin (name unknown). It is not logical to conclude that someone who believes Jesus’ mother was a virgin could only have access to this tradition via either of the gospels of Matthew or Luke. (I suppose one could believe that both Matthew and Luke created the virgin birth independently of each other and the rest of the Christian tradition and so Aristides could only know of the virgin birth if he had read either or their gospels.)
If someone quoted from Q and had no words which only Matthew or Luke have, then we could not conclude that the author knew Luke rather than Matthew or Q, or Matthew rather than Luke or Q. If the author did not use the same words as Q, then there would exist the possibility that they knew the tradition independent of Q, Luke and Matthew. (Your discussion of 1 Clement 15 seems aware of different possibilities and you have compared the Greek words.)
You are not alone in thinking of a date c 96.Bernard Muller wrote: My dating of the epistle of Barnabas:7.4 Dating:
As we saw already, the epistle was written after the fall of Jerusalem in 70C.E.
Can we determine a more accurate dating?
Let's consider:
Barnabas4:3-4 "The last offence is at hand, ... For to this end the Master has cut the seasons and the days short, that His beloved might hasten and come to His inheritance.
[the end" was expected soon, as also in 4:9 "... let us take heed in these last days ..." and 21:3 "The day is at hand ...". This is typical of 1st century Christian writings]
"` ... Ten reigns shall reign upon the earth, and after them shall arise another king, who shall bring low three of the kings under one."
Do these ten and three kings make sense in a 1st century context?
The three kings might be the Flavian dynasty (Vespasian and sons Titus & Domitian). It was ended by the accession to the Roman throne by Nerva (96-98), the same day of Domitian's murder. Nerva may have been thought to be the king who brought low the previous threesome.
Barnabas 4:4-5 (Lake)
Maxwell Staniforth adds “Daniel” in verse 4 after “Prophet” and suggests Daniel 7:24 as a parallel4 And the Prophet also says thus: "Ten kingdoms shall reign upon the earth and there shall rise up after them a little king, who shall subdue three of the kings under one."
5 Daniel says likewise concerning the same: "And I beheld the fourth Beast, wicked and powerful and fiercer than all the beasts of the sea, and that ten horns sprang from it, and out of them a little excrescent horn, and that it subdued under one three of the great horns."
And Daniel 7:7-8 as a parallel to verse 4[24] As for the ten horns,
out of this kingdom
ten kings shall arise,
and another shall arise after them;
he shall be different from the former ones,
and shall put down three kings.
As Barnabas is quoting Daniel there is no need to see in them a reference to the current time. The author could see them as events in the future which still have to happen and not events in the recent past which set the scene for the end of times. Even if there is reference to three kings being subdued they could be the kings of Dacia, Armenia and Parthia under Trajan. Should we even equal kings with emperors? If we are looking for ten emperors then why not, Augustus, Tiberius, Caligula, Claudius, Nero, Vespasian, Titus, Domitian, Nerva and Trajan?[7] …, a fourth beast, terrible and dreadful and exceedingly strong; …; and it had ten horns.
[8] … there came up among them another horn, a little one, before which three of the first horns were plucked up by the roots; ...
Bernard I didn’t consider any other translation, I just picked Lake because I thought it would be a more current English translation.Ben C. Smith wrote: ↑Sun Oct 22, 2017 8:37 pmThis is Ehrman's text from the Loeb edition:Bernard Muller wrote: ↑Sun Oct 22, 2017 8:06 pmNo, it is wishful thinking for an action in the future.3 Furthermore he says again, "Lo, they who destroyed this temple shall themselves build it."
4 That is happening now. For owing to the war it was destroyed by the enemy; at present even the servants of the enemy will build it up again. (Lake)
And "that is happening now" might be a misleading translation. There are others such as "So it cometh to pass" (Lightfoot) and "And so doth it happen" (Hoole).
Maybe Ben can clarify that, as for also the Greek tense for the two verbs.
Barnabas 16.3-4: 3 Moreover he says again, "See, those who have destroyed [καθελόντες, aorist tense] this temple will themselves build [οἰκοδομήσουσιν, future tense] it." 4 This is happening [γίνεται, present tense]. For because of their war it was destroyed [καθῃρέθη, aorist tense] by their enemies. And now the servants of the enemies will themselves rebuild [ἀνοικοδομήσουσιν, future tense] it.
Well, "it is happening" is definitely in present tense. But what is "it" that is happening? Surely not the destruction, which is twice represented by the aorist tense. And surely not the (re)building, which is twice represented by the future tense. I think "it" (which is only implied in the Greek) is the prophecy itself, namely that those who destroyed the temple will themselves rebuild it. I think it means that the prophecy is in the process of being fulfilled; it has two parts (destruction and rebuilding), and the writer stands between the two events.
It seems that their enemy destroyed it and the servants of the enemies are going to rebuilt it. If the enemy is the Romans, then the servants of the enemy are the workers of the Romans. This would fit 130 /131 CE when Hadrian had announced he was going to rebuild the Temple.