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On the need of a Judas to recognize Jesus
Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2018 12:39 am
by Giuseppe
Mark 14:43-44:
43 Just as he was speaking, Judas, one of the Twelve, appeared. With him was a crowd armed with swords and clubs, sent from the chief priests, the teachers of the law, and the elders.
44 Now the betrayer had arranged a signal with them: “The one I kiss is the man; arrest him and lead him away under guard.”
Why the need of a
Judas to recognize Jesus
contra factum that all the people knew Jesus ?
Because so there is no doubt that Jesus is really "from the Jews", i.e. he is really the davidic Christ and not the Christ of an alien deity.
Not coincidentially just a
Judas has to recognize
infallibly him.
Re: On the need of a Judas to recognize Jesus
Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2018 3:10 am
by toejam
Nah. Cheesy story telling is a less extravagant and thus more likely bet.
Re: On the need of a Judas to recognize Jesus
Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2018 3:31 am
by Giuseppe
Have you a better explanation ?
Re: On the need of a Judas to recognize Jesus
Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:25 am
by andrewcriddle
It is after all the middle of the night. This could make identification difficult.
Andrew Criddle
Re: On the need of a Judas to recognize Jesus
Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:31 am
by Giuseppe
andrewcriddle wrote: ↑Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:25 am
It is after all the middle of the night. This could make identification difficult.
Andrew Criddle
you are making
really the my case: if the
identification was so difficult, why should just a
Judas have been the one to do it?
Re: On the need of a Judas to recognize Jesus
Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:15 am
by John T
So as to prevent a riot.
Thousands of Jesus followers were encamped outside the city wall for Passover.
The Chief Priests needed Jesus to be taken into custody quietly and likely promised him (via Judas) safe passage if he did.
So, they did it at night and used his broker (Judas) to get the guards unmolested through the masses without starting a riot.
Now stop and think, what would happen to Judas if Jesus was not there?
Occman's razor.
Sincerely,
John T
Re: On the need of a Judas to recognize Jesus
Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:08 am
by Giuseppe
John T wrote: ↑Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:15 am
Now stop and think, what would happen to
Judas if Jesus was not there?
I think that
you are
totally unable (!) to grasp why jus
t ''Judas'' had to be the name of the person who, in the middle and obscurity of the night, just in the moment where, most of all,
there was the concrete risk that Jesus could be taken for a robber [just as the
other Jesus,
Jesus Barabbas, aka the marcionite
''Jesus Son of Father''], was the
only person, among all, to recognize
infallibly Jesus.
Re: On the need of a Judas to recognize Jesus
Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:50 am
by John T
Giuseppe wrote: ↑Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:08 am
John T wrote: ↑Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:15 am
Now stop and think, what would happen to
Judas if Jesus was not there?
I think that
you are
totally unable (!) to grasp why jus
t ''Judas'' had to be the name of the person who, in the middle and obscurity of the night, just in the moment where, most of all,
there was the concrete risk that Jesus could be taken for a robber [just as the
other Jesus,
Jesus Barabbas, aka the marcionite
''Jesus Son of Father''], was the
only person, among all, to recognize
infallibly Jesus.
Then help me with my ignorance. Help me grasp what you clearly understand about the meaning of the name
Judas.
Re: On the need of a Judas to recognize Jesus
Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 7:53 am
by Giuseppe
John T wrote: ↑Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:50 am
Then help me with my ignorance. Help me grasp what you clearly understand about the meaning of the name
Judas.
the fact that just
Judas and only
Judas recognized Jesus confirms
without shadow of doubt that Jesus is
really the son of the god
of the Jews and
not of an unknown Father (at contrary of the robber "Jesus Barabbas"/"Jesus Son of Father"). Against the Gnostics.
Against Marcion.
Re: On the need of a Judas to recognize Jesus
Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:04 pm
by John T
Giuseppe wrote: ↑Sat Jul 07, 2018 7:53 am
John T wrote: ↑Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:50 am
Then help me with my ignorance. Help me grasp what you clearly understand about the meaning of the name
Judas.
the fact that just
Judas and only
Judas recognized Jesus confirms
without shadow of doubt that Jesus is
really the son of the god
of the Jews and
not of an unknown Father (at contrary of the robber "Jesus Barabbas"/"Jesus Son of Father"). Against the Gnostics.
Against Marcion.
Sadly, I remain in my ignorance.