andrewcriddle wrote:There seem to be two issues according to Acts: a/ Should Christians of Gentile background follow Torah ? b/ Should Christians of Jewish background follow Torah ?
According to Acts it is generally known that Paul answers no to question a/ but this will be tolerated by rhe Jewish Christians in Jerusalem as long as they are convinced that Paul answers yes to question b/. (Since Paul himself is of Jewish background, his own behaviour provides evidence as to his answer to question b/.)
Andrew Criddle
Could you be a little more specific as to whether you think Paul answers question /b as "yes" or "no"? I do not think the matter is as obvious as you seem to imply.
Mark Nanos (Mystery of Romans & Irony of Galatians) demonstrates that Paul did think that "Christians of Jewish background [should] follow Torah." My own research, which cuts "Christianity" out of the equation (as it is in the text as editorial/redactional interpolations and glosses only), also indicated that the original author (Paul) was Torah observant and not ashamed of it.
However, despite the evidence that Paul felt that Jews should continue to practice the Mosaic law (as far as possible outside the holy land, as conditions permit), many critics latch onto his insistence that Gentile's who follow Christ (Nanos) or love God (my POV) may lay claim to benefits promised by God on the basis of faith alone, thus making observance of Mosaic Law not incumbent upon them, and then say this rule applicable only to gentile believers overrides the other rule just mentioned, that Jewish people are under obligation to continue to observe the Mosaic law.
DCH
First of all I thnk that the Paul in Acts expects Christians of Jewish background to usually continue to observe Torah.
The question of Paul in the epistles is not entirely clear. IIUC Paul is committed to several principles which may conflict.
a/ It is not necessary for Christians of Jewish background to observe Torah.
b/ Preserving fellowship between Jewish and Gentile Christians overrides strict Torah observance.
c/ For a Jewish Christian to cease Torah observance against their own moral judgment in order to conform with Gentile Christians may be seriously sinful. (Their moral judgment may be over narrow but it is sinful to override it just for the sake of conformity.)
First Post here!
I know (and probably irritate...) a number Posters from other forums who have made their way here. "There goes the neighborhood!"
I hope that it'll be good to be here.
Jay-
I just got through re-reading Hyam Maccoby's, _The Mythmaker_, and many of your concerns are answered. Maccoby gets some things wrong in the "Story" of Jesus, the Apostles and especially Paul but he goes into great detail on Paul and "The Jerusalem Church". One key idea is that the transition to what became Christianity is to be found in analyzing what appears to be a "collegial atmosphere" between James et.al. and Paul. This turns quickly into a realization that the actual conditions were extremely hostile between the two camps, with Paul barely escaping with his life and quite a few gold coins as well.
Once Paul declares that his "revelations" came from no man, literally nothing else matters. Revelation trumps Experience and Paul uses this to bash his way through whatever obstacles he finds.
I don't want to get into a long first Post but Maccoby's is a very valuable book to consider for illumination on this subject. I can quote and summarize as much as needed here.
I read Maccoby a number of years ago and found him very good on a number of points. Yes, the hostility between Paul and the Jerusalem Church of God is deep and I believe reflects a real split in the early John/Joshua community.
Warmly,
Jay Raskin
Charles Wilson wrote:Hello everyone-
First Post here!
I know (and probably irritate...) a number Posters from other forums who have made their way here. "There goes the neighborhood!"
I hope that it'll be good to be here.
Jay-
I just got through re-reading Hyam Maccoby's, _The Mythmaker_, and many of your concerns are answered. Maccoby gets some things wrong in the "Story" of Jesus, the Apostles and especially Paul but he goes into great detail on Paul and "The Jerusalem Church". One key idea is that the transition to what became Christianity is to be found in analyzing what appears to be a "collegial atmosphere" between James et.al. and Paul. This turns quickly into a realization that the actual conditions were extremely hostile between the two camps, with Paul barely escaping with his life and quite a few gold coins as well.
Once Paul declares that his "revelations" came from no man, literally nothing else matters. Revelation trumps Experience and Paul uses this to bash his way through whatever obstacles he finds.
I don't want to get into a long first Post but Maccoby's is a very valuable book to consider for illumination on this subject. I can quote and summarize as much as needed here.