Why does the Hymn to Philippians insist so much on obedience?

[Giuseppe]

Two possibilities:

1) the Hymn was composed against a figure who was always disobedient against YHWH.
This figure could be not adored.
And in this case the figure was Satan.
This figure could be adored. By Gnostic haters of YHWH.


2) the Hymn was composed against a figure who was partially (=only for an interval of time) disobedient against YHWH, but then he was converted and forgiven for the his disobedience.

This figure could be not adored.
And in this case the figure was Adam.
This figure could be adored. As the demiurge Sabaoth in the Hypostasis of Archons. A figure of compromise between Gnostics and Judaizers.

This means that the name ''Jesus'' was given to the Son in the Hymn to Philippians, as reward for the his obedience.

The name was 'YHWH-saves' (Joshua) as function of the obedience to YHWH.

This explains why in Mark Jesus was the his first apparition when he goes - obediently - to be baptised for the his sins: an act of obedience to YHWH.

This explains why in Matthew the name ''Jesus'' is given by the angel to the future son of Mary: the matthean Mary was obedient against the markan Mary, notoriously rebel against the son Jesus.

This means that the Christianity was born as caused by two factors:

1) the recognition that another deity had to be adored, before or after, not only YHWH.

2) the need that this new deity had to be obedient to YHWH.


Both the two factors are at work in the pre-pauline Hymn of Philippians.

[Ben C. Smith]

Or:

Ba'al and Môt: "And go down to the house of freedom in the depth of the earth, and be counted among them those who go down into the earth, and you will know nothingness, like mortals, for you will have become as one who has died!" Obeys does Mightiest Ba'al.

Philippians 2.5-11: 5 Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, 6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, 7 but emptied Himself, taking the form of a slave, and being made in the likeness of men. 8 Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. 9 For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, 10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

[Giuseppe]

Ba'al didn't receive the name ''Ba'al'' as effect of the his act of obedience.

The Son received the name of 'Jesus' since he was obedient to YHWH.

A competition against who was threatening the supremacy of YHWH is in sight here.

At the origin of Christianity.

[perseusomega9]

Guess that's settled then.

[Ben C. Smith]

Guess that's settled then.

Whew. Saves the rest of us a lot of work.

[Giuseppe]

This is the passage in Hypostasis of Archons where there are the same three actions (pre-existence ---> kenosis ----> exaltation) of the Hymn of Philippians.

This ruler, by being androgynous, made himself a vast realm, an extent without limit. And he contemplated creating offspring for himself, and created for himself seven offspring, androgynous just like their parent. And he said to his offspring, "It is I who am god of the entirety."
And Zoe (Life), the daughter of Pistis Sophia, cried out and said to him, "You are mistaken, Sakla!" – for which the alternative name is Yaltabaoth. She breathed into his face, and her breath became a fiery angel for her; and that angel bound Yaldabaoth and cast him down into Tartaros below the abyss.
Now when his offspring Sabaoth saw the force of that angel, he repented and condemned his father and his mother, matter. He loathed her, but he sang songs of praise up to Sophia and her daughter Zoe. And Sophia and Zoe caught him up and gave him charge of the seventh heaven, below the veil between above and below. And he is called 'God of the forces, Sabaoth', since he is up above the forces of chaos, for Sophia established him.

http://gnosis.org/naghamm/hypostas.html


What I am explaining in this thread is the reason of the name ''Jesus'' for the celestial archangel adored by the Pillars and Paul: the his salvation was the salvation of YHWH insofar he was obedient to YHWH.

Not rebel as Satan was, as Adam was, as Yaldabaoth was, as the Serpent of the Ophites/Naassenes was.