James Tabor Visited the Pantera Grave in Germany

[Stephan Huller]

sorry I can't post the photos for some reason here

[toejam]

Yeah, so Tabor still thinks Pantera is Jesus' father? I read The Jesus Dynasty and his argument for Pantera... but I wasn't convinced. I don't think his idea gets beyond the level of speculation. Is anyone convinced?

[Metacrock]

Yeah, so Tabor still thinks Pantera is Jesus' father? I read The Jesus Dynasty and his argument for Pantera... but I wasn't convinced. I don't think his idea gets beyond the level of speculation. Is anyone convinced?

It's silly. why doesn't he go to Kashmere and visit the alleged gave of Jesus there? Then the one in Japan.

[DCHindley]

sorry I can't post the photos for some reason here

You mean this 'un?



Or a publicity photo?

Actually, there is a fair degree of probability that this Tiberius Abdes Pantera could have been the man that Jews associated with Mary's pregnancy. Could a Roman Auxiliary archer Pantera have knocked up at least one nice Jewish girl? Oh, I think so. However, the question remains, why him? I'd like to know more about the name Pantera and how widespread it was, and what it meant to Jews.

Mr. Scowling Waggyfinger (formerly DCH)

[toejam]

While we're on this topic, I'd love to hear some opinions on Tabor... To me he seems to tred that fine line between writing 'historical fiction' and 'historical reconstruction'. Some of his views are quite radical and suspect, others are quite conservative. For me he too often draws 'conclusions' from very thin evidence - he lets his vivid imagination get away from him at times. His last book Paul & Jesus wasn't too bad though...

[Ulan]

I think he is going the sensationalist path, not sure whether out of concern for money or out of real conviction. I don't find his conclusions from archeology convincing.

On the other hand, some of his blog posts are quite insightful. I really like the one about the development of resurrection beliefs.

[John T]

I too have read and very much enjoyed Tabor's book: "The Jesus Dynasty".
My hard copy printed in 2006 on pg. 68 contains a picture of Tobot examining the Pantera gravestone in Germany. Perhaps Tabor has changed his mind since then but he did not give it a thumbs up in his book.

Tobot grants that Pantera was a Roman soldier and likely a Jew with the right name, the right occupation, the right place and time but still the chances are infinitesimally small and short of a DNA test he will not be convinced.

Futhermore, he seems to share that much of his ideas sprang from Robert Eisenman, of which I'm currently reading his book: "James the Brother of Jesus and the Dead Sea Scroll. A very good read if you are into trying to figure out the connection between the Essenes and the leader of the early Christian church, i.e. James the Just.

[Stephan Huller]

Sure.

[DCHindley]

According to Adolf Deissmann, in Light from the Ancient East (1978 reprint of the ET of the fourth, 1923, German edition), this tombstone was found near Bingerbruck, relocated at the time (1908 or so) to the museum at Kreuznach. There is a picture on pg 75, and a transcription and translation in footnote 3 on page 74.

Tib. Iul. Abdes. Pantera
Sidonia. ann. LXII
stipen. XXXX. miles. exs.
coh. I. sagettariorum.
h. s. e.

Tiberuis Julius Abdes Pantera
of Sidon, aged 62
a soldier of 40 years' service
of the 1st cohort of archers,
lies here

Tabor grants that Pantera was a Roman soldier and likely a Jew with the right name, the right occupation, the right place and time but still the chances are infinitesimally small and short of a DNA test he will not be convinced.

According to Deissmann, "The name "Panthera" is found frequently in inscriptions of the Imperial period as a cognomen of both men and women." (pg 73-74) He also points to an article he wrote (in German) which gives examples.

On page 74, says the cohort in which he served came to the Rhine in 9 CE, but without stating where this fact can be found, so I'd suggest looking for an authority on the Roman army if you want to chase this detail.

The name "Abdes," according to Deissmann, footnote 4 (pg 74), is an Aramaic phrase for "servant of Isis," but it is also found as a name. Since his name "Abdes" means a devotee of Isis, I doubt the man is a Jew. Aramaic was spoken everywhere in the Ancient Near East in the 1st century CE, at least in the countryside.

Futhermore, he seems to share that much of his ideas sprang from Robert Eisenman, of which I'm currently reading his book: "James the Brother of Jesus and the Dead Sea Scroll. A very good read if you are into trying to figure out the connection between the Essenes and the leader of the early Christian church, i.e. James the Just.

While I actually have corresponded with Eisenmann on several occasions, he has this tendency of presenting every possible angle on an issue, without a very good job of teasing out the wheat from the chaff.

An interesting study of the Ben Pantera stories from the Talmud (although most probably outdated) is in Did Jesus Live 100 BC? (G. R. S. Mead, 1904 and occasionally reprinted), pages 129-130 (describing the situation in which the Pantera legend is first mentioned by Origen), and 154-155 (a discussion of the origin of the nickname in Jewish traditions). He gives a short bibliography of mainly German works, with English summarization, in the footnotes of page 155.

The entire cycle of Talmud stories is covered in a series of chapters ranging from pages 135 to 242, and the Toledoth Jeschu stories from pages 242 to 323. If you are interested in evidence for early Christian knowledge of these traditions, he traces these in pages 116 to 134 and then 324 to 412.

If the Jewish "Ben Pantera" tradition interests you, R. Travers Herford also discusses them (and provides translations and extracts in the original language from the Talmud and Midrash) in Christianity in Talmud and Midrash (1903 and also reprinted now and then) pages 35ff (especially in footnote 2 on page 39), 103ff, 138, 344ff.

[John T]

@DCHindley,

I am by no means a scholar and beg forgiveness if it came across that I was pretending to be. I do have great respect for the opinions of those that are and it is obvious your knowledge is vast, apparently more so than Eisenman.

So, if you would be so kind to finish the job of Eisenman and tease out the wheat from the chaff for me?

Did Jesus have a full-brother named James who became the leader of the Church in Jerusalem and was martyred around 62 A.D.?
Respectfully submitted,

John T