Already a problem: where is the "celestial temple"?"This certainly seems to say Jesus died in outer space.47 Because here we're told that Jesus not only performed his sacrifice in the celestial temple (as in Heb. 9, as we'll see in a moment), but that he had to do so.
According to: "The sum of what we've said is this: we have such a High Priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of His Majesty in the heavens, a minister of the sanctuary and of the true tabernacle that the Lord set up."
The "celestial" temple is not in the air, where death could occur (even if Kapyong did not provide any examples for that belief) but in the highest heaven, next to God, where death cannot occur, therefore also Jesus' sacrifice.
Carrier is deliberately combining the lower heaven (the air below the moon) and the upper one, above the firmament, the domain of spirits and immortality. Both heavens have become the celestial realm. Kapyong, you may have to redraw your maps.We're also told that Jesus wasn't ever on earth—instead, he could only have been God's celestial high priest (so as to perform the ultimate sacrifice) if he wasn't on earth. Because "if he were on earth, he would not be a priest', since earth already has its priests—but Jesus needs to be a priest, in order to mediate the new covenant (Heb. 8.6)
Yes, Jesus had to be a priest, but there were priests on earth, so he had to go to heaven after his sacrifice in order to mediate the new covenant as the heavenly high priest. I do not see why the sacrifice cannot be on earth according to the quote. Certainly the sacrifice in the highest heaven does not make any sense. And by demons, on a cross, in the "celestial" sanctuary, next to God? how scary!
Ascension of Isaiah again (very dependable!!!), the gospel of Carrier. Once again, the duplicate would be in the highest heaven (as in Revelation), not in the air below the moon.We're also told here the same thing Isaiah was told in the Ascension: that everything on earth has a duplicate version of it in the heavens (hence Element 38).
Again, "celestial" includes God's highest heaven. How convenient! Gosh, a blood sacrifice in heaven right by God's side!The implication is that Jesus' blood must have been spilled on the heavenly duplicate of God's altar—not on earth, where there already are priests making blood sacrifices, which are less effective than celestial ones. Yet Jesus, being perfect, was the most powerful sacrifice of all (Heb. 7.27-28)
Or maybe the blood here is symbolic, not real, typifying Jesus' past sacrifice (on earth).
No, 'Ascension of Isaiah' does not say that.in the Ascension of Isaiah (Chapter 3, §1). We saw that in the earliest discernible redaction of the latter, the Jesus who passes through the heavens dies in outer space, in the sublunar heaven, not on earth.
In order to pass through the heavens, with the ultimate destination being the highest heaven, next to God, what would be the starting point? Earth.'Jesus the Son of God is the great high priest who has passed through the heavens'
I sure would like to know about element 40. I was told by Amazon I would have to wait one month before I get THE book.You might notice that that sounds exactly like the celestial high priest named Jesus in early Jewish theology (Element 40)
Cordially, Bernard