In this reading two major Jewish Revolt leaders in Jerusalem, John of Gischala and Simon bar Giora, appear in Christian texts and legend respectively as the post-70 Johannine-Christianity John of Asia Minor, and Simon Peter, in Christian texts post-70. A third Revolt leader, Jesus ben Sapphat, a warlord in Galilee aligned with John, becomes the historical Jesus, well known to Josephus who tells in Vita of entering into secret league with Jesus and tells stories about Jesus in Galilee. Jesus’s fate is not told in Josephus but he could well have come to Jerusalem at the time John’s forces did, or by some other means. Then there is the critical incident in which Josephus tells of interceding to have an unnamed acquaintance brought down from the cross after being crucified by the Romans, given medical treatment and restored to live again, among three crucified the other two of whom died of their injuries after being taken down; the one who lived could well have been Josephus’s former comrade Jesus in light of the parallel story so central to Christianity of Jesus resurrected back to life after “Joseph of Arimethea” (= Josephus son of Matthias), “secret disciple of Jesus” (i.e. no one else knew Josephus was and Josephus was not confirming that), interceded to have Jesus taken down from the cross.
Paul’s letters do not date themselves internally pre-70 CE, apart from the Aretas allusion understood to be Aretas IV mentioned above. The reason the letters considered genuine of Paul ARE firmly dated pre-70 by ca. 100% of New Testament scholars is paradoxically on the basis of texts which many of the same scholars openly concede are not reliable for history: namely the Gospels and Acts.
In the end, the argument for the letters of Paul as post-70, apart from plausibility and making better sense closer to the time of publication of the collection as you noted, is its consistency with a picture in which Christian origins is arguably better understood as emerging out of and in the aftermath of the First Revolt.
Paul’s letters do not date themselves internally pre-70 CE, apart from the Aretas allusion understood to be Aretas IV mentioned above. The reason the letters considered genuine of Paul ARE firmly dated pre-70 by ca. 100% of New Testament scholars is paradoxically on the basis of texts which many of the same scholars openly concede are not reliable for history: namely the Gospels and Acts.
In the end, the argument for the letters of Paul as post-70, apart from plausibility and making better sense closer to the time of publication of the collection as you noted, is its consistency with a picture in which Christian origins is arguably better understood as emerging out of and in the aftermath of the First Revolt.
My problem with this point is that the two thieves detail are part and parcel of the same anti-marcionite polemic behind the titulus crucis, identifying univocally the principal victim as the Jewish Messiah. When at contrary for Marcion the true Jesus was the "Jesus Son of Father" (parodied by the Judaizers as 'Jesus Bar-Abbas').
So, if the Joseph of Arimatea is Josephus and the two thieves are derived from the Josephian episode described above, then the point that is going to be made is always anti-marcionite and therefore not original of the Earliest Gospel Passion Story, that included only the following episode :
So they bound Jesus, led him away and handed him over to Pilate.
“Are you the king of the Jews?” asked Pilate.
“You have said so,” Jesus replied.
[Pilate] had Jesus flogged, and handed him over to be crucified.
“Are you the king of the Jews?” asked Pilate.
“You have said so,” Jesus replied.
[Pilate] had Jesus flogged, and handed him over to be crucified.