Did Marcion believe that the Christ of the Creator was already arrived? If yes, when?

Discussion about the New Testament, apocrypha, gnostics, church fathers, Christian origins, historical Jesus or otherwise, etc.
Post Reply
User avatar
Giuseppe
Posts: 13918
Joined: Mon Apr 27, 2015 5:37 am
Location: Italy

Did Marcion believe that the Christ of the Creator was already arrived? If yes, when?

Post by Giuseppe »

Reading this passage:

Marcion of Pontus succeeded him, and developed his doctrine. In so doing, he advanced the most daring blasphemy against Him who is proclaimed as God by the law and the prophets, declaring Him to be the author of evils, to take delight in war, to be infirm of purpose, and even to be contrary to Himself. But Jesus being derived from that father who is above the God that made the world, and coming into Judæa in the times of Pontius Pilate the governor, who was the procurator of Tiberius Cæsar, was manifested in the form of a man to those who were in Judæa, abolishing the prophets and the law, and all the works of that God who made the world, whom also he calls Cosmocrator.

https://www.newadvent.org/fathers/0103127.htm

...it seems that Marcion raised a relation of cause-effect between the fact that YHWH loved the war and the fact that Jesus came sub Pontio Pilato:

Jesus came under Pilate BECAUSE YHWH had taken "delight in war".

And it is easy to imagine what was the war in question where YHWH had "delight" in: the First Jewish Revolt of 70 CE.

Hence, a quesite arises: factually, how could YHWH have "taken delight" in the war of 70 CE?

Best answer: by moving his people, the Jews, against the rest of the known world.

Hence, the messiah of YHWH was active during the First Jewish Revolt of 70 CE. Who could be ?


John of Giscala?

Simon Bar Gioras?

Or the last high priest of the Temple? Joshua ben Sapphat?
User avatar
Giuseppe
Posts: 13918
Joined: Mon Apr 27, 2015 5:37 am
Location: Italy

Re: Did Marcion believe that the Christ of the Creator was already arrived? If yes, when?

Post by Giuseppe »

Another answer to the same quesite:

The Book of Revelation has Jesus appear shortly in human form when the celestial Woman is persecuted by Rome/Dragon.

That Jesus is surely one who, talking in marcionite terms, "takes delight in war".

Hence, it is having that Jesus in mind, as active in the period when the original Book of Revelation was written (70-90 CE), that Marcion could place his Jesus the Good Son of Father Unknown ("Bar-Abbas") before the Jesus of the Creator. How many years before?
Post Reply