Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

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Kunigunde Kreuzerin
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Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

Post by Kunigunde Kreuzerin »

I have a request and need some help for the understanding of Mark 2:28. It seems to me that Mark 2:28 can be understood at first glance in a different sense than traditionally assumed. I try to be clear about whether this other understanding is possible and to what extent. Please note that this is not my opinion of Mark 2:28, but only an experiment.

I will make three arguments for the possibility (!!!) of the different understanding and hope that someone will judge these arguments or make counter-arguments.

Mark 2:28
ὥστε κύριός ἐστιν ὁ υἱὸς τοῦ ἀνθρώπου καὶ τοῦ σαββάτου
hōste kyrios estin ho Huios tou anthrōpou kai tou sabbatou
We all know that “καὶ“ means mainly “and” und you can see that the genitive “τοῦ σαββάτου“ is according to the word order rather related to the word “υἱὸς“. I think that at first glance we would translate with “So Lord is the son of the man and of the sabbath” or with fronting of the subject “So the son of the man and of the sabbath is lord.”

arguments

1. Mark has no problem to create unusual combinations with the word “υἱὸς“ (huios), look at Mark 2:19 “υἱοὶ τοῦ νυμφῶνος“ (sons of the bridechamber).

2. We do not know when the resurrection occurred in the imagination of Mark. Theoretically it would be possible that the process of resurrection happened on the Sabbath. In this case, the risen Jesus could be - in a figurative sense – a son or an offspring of the Sabbath.

3. Jesus has two Sabbath controversies in GMark - Mark 2:23-28 (Plucking grain on Sabbath) and Mark 3:1-6 (Man with a withered hand). The first scene is loaded with vocabulary from LXX-Genesis 1 and 2, ποιέω (poieó) in Mark 2:23.24.25 and ἐγένετο (egeneto) in Mark 2:27 (“The Sabbath on account of the man was made ...”). The second scene shows new creation on the sabbath, because the withered hand is rather dead than sick and the man must first “arise” in Mark 3:3. It is clear that Mark has an interest in creation on Sabbath.
Stephan Huller
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Re: Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

Post by Stephan Huller »

This is an interesting point. It seems counterintuitive not to see two genitives being joined by the καὶ and modifying υἱὸς. I think they take the greater context of the passage as decisive. But this is dangerous because (a) the Marcionite reading agrees with Mark here and (b) the context may originally have been different.
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JoeWallack
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Re: Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

Post by JoeWallack »

Who's Your Daddy?

Kunigunde, ain't no passing phrase.
It's "Mark's" problem free, philosophy.
Acuta Markata.


JW:
I think it's been demonstrated here Ad Nazorean that there is no quality evidence (Source Criticism) for oral tradition as a source for GMark. That opens up Literary Criticism as evidence for sources and as has also been demonstrated here, there is quality Literary Criticism evidence for sources. Literary Contrivance is evidence that the source is the author's imagination (fiction).

I previously indicated evidence of contrivance in GMark with the author's connection of the only two mentions of "Isaiah" with baptism stories:

"Mark's" DiualCritical Marks. Evidence Of Intentional Fiction In The Original Gospel. Part II

Similarly, "Mark" (author) invokes the name "David" a few more times than he does "Isaiah" and again appears to have a connected theme which supports the answer to the question of this Thread as "42", er, sorry, that "Lord of the Sabbath" is "Mark's" intended (marriage in Heaven).

"Mark's" spot on invocations of "David":
  • Chapter 2
    28 so that the Son of man is lord even of the sabbath.
    The question of the Thread, "Lord of the sabbath" or son of the sabbath?

    Speaker = Jesus
    • Chapter 10
      48 And many rebuked him, that he should hold his peace: but he cried out the more a great deal, Thou son of David, have mercy on me.
      Jesus positively identified by good old whatshisface as "son of David".

      Speaker = not Jesus


      Chapter 11
      Blessed [is]the kingdom that cometh, [the kingdom] of our father David: Hosanna in the highest.
      David's kingdom positively identified by "The Jews"

      Speaker = not Jesus
  • Chapter 12
    37 David himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he his son? And the common people heard him gladly.
    The question is who is David's Lord?

    Speaker = Jesus
I see a nice little contrived (I leave it to the Reader to decide what percent has a source of me) chiasm here that connects the invocation of the name "David" to the issue of Jesus' identity. The first and last instances are also connected by "Mark's" Jesus doing the speaking. Since there is agreement that "Lord" is a part of the key phrase of the last use here than that supports that "Lord" is also a part of the key phrase of the first use.

For those who want to catch more of my Acts I'll be appearing all week on top of the highest mountain with a high powered rifling through Scriptures here.


Joseph
Stephan Huller
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Re: Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

Post by Stephan Huller »

But can we be certain that the present context was the original? Here is the context in Tertullian's source gospel or Marcion:
By God, however, would that be done which the man Christ was to do, for He was likewise God. Wishing, therefore, to initiate them into this meaning of the law by the restoration of the withered hand, He requires, “Is it lawful on the Sabbath-days to do good, or not? to save life, or to destroy it?” [Mark 3:4.] In order that He might, whilst allowing that amount of work which He was about to perform for a soul, remind them what works the law of the Sabbath forbade — even human works; and what it enjoined — even divine works, which might be done for the benefit of any soul, He was called “Lord of the Sabbath,” [Mark 2:28] because He maintained the Sabbath as His own institution. Now, even if He had annulled the Sabbath, He would have had the right to do so, as being its Lord, (and) still more as He who instituted it. But He did not utterly destroy it, although its Lord, in order that it might henceforth be plain that the Sabbath was not broken by the Creator, even at the time when the ark was carried around Jericho. For that was really God’s work, which He commanded Himself, and which He had ordered for the sake of the lives of His servants when exposed to the perils of war.
But notice that Tertullian's source quotes the story from Mark not Luke for Luke has the story:
One Sabbath Jesus was going through the grainfields, and his disciples began to pick some heads of grain, rub them in their hands and eat the kernels. 2 Some of the Pharisees asked, “Why are you doing what is unlawful on the Sabbath?” Jesus answered them, “Have you never read what David did when he and his companions were hungry? 4 He entered the house of God, and taking the consecrated bread, he ate what is lawful only for priests to eat. And he also gave some to his companions.” 5 Then Jesus said to them, “The Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath.” (καὶ ἔλεγεν αὐτοῖς Κύριός ἐστιν τοῦ σαββάτου ὁ Υἱὸς τοῦ ἀνθρώπου)
But Tertullian cites the story from Mark against Marcion (references highlighted):
Another time Jesus went into the synagogue, and a man with a shriveled hand was there. 2 Some of them were looking for a reason to accuse Jesus, so they watched him closely to see if he would heal him on the Sabbath. 3 Jesus said to the man with the shriveled hand, “Stand up in front of everyone.” 4 Then Jesus asked them, “Which is lawful on the Sabbath: to do good or to do evil, to save life or to kill?” But they remained silent. 5 He looked around at them in anger and, deeply distressed at their stubborn hearts, said to the man, “Stretch out your hand.” He stretched it out, and his hand was completely restored. 6 Then the Pharisees went out and began to plot with the Herodians how they might kill Jesus.
Tertullian's source witnessing the order of the Marcionite gospel makes the statement Mark 2:28 follow THIS STORY and so the alternative suggestion makes perfect sense when answering the objection of both healing a man and on the Sabbath.
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Re: Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

Post by Kunigunde Kreuzerin »

JoeWallack wrote:Similarly, "Mark" (author) invokes the name "David" a few more times than he does "Isaiah" and again appears to have a connected theme which supports the answer to the question of this Thread as "42", er, sorry, that "Lord of the Sabbath" is "Mark's" intended (marriage in Heaven).
...
I see a nice little contrived ... chiasm here that connects the invocation of the name "David" to the issue of Jesus' identity. The first and last instances are also connected by "Mark's" Jesus doing the speaking. Since there is agreement that "Lord" is a part of the key phrase of the last use here than that supports that "Lord" is also a part of the key phrase of the first use.Joseph
Thanks, Joe. I've seen the markan David-links and agree. Maybe I have you poorly understood, but it seems to me that your argument does not affect the crucial point. The “Lord” is not in question.

The question is
- whether the Son of Man and the Son of Sabbath is Lord or
- whether the Son of Man is Lord and also Lord of Sabbath.

@Stephan: Sorry, that I first answer to Joe's post, but that is easier for me. I need to think a bit more about the version of Marcion.
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Re: Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

Post by Stephan Huller »

Another citation of the material to help gain (perhaps) an underlying different context for the saying. From Clement's Stromata:
Similar doctrines are expressed by Prodicus’ school, who falsely claim the name of Gnostics for themselves, calling themselves natural sons of the primal god. They make wrong use of their high birth and freedom to live as they will. What they will is a life of pleasure-loving, having come to the conclusion that they are inferior to none, being lords of the sabbath, and born princes superior to all humankind. For a king, they say, there is no written law. In the first place, they do not do all they want; many things will stand in the way of their desires and efforts. Further, what they do do, they do not as kings but as slaves liable to flogging; they are in fear of discovery in their secret adulteries; they are evading condemnation; they are afraid of punishment. How can a combination of immoderation and dirty language be freedom? "Everyone who sins is a slave," says the Apostle. How can the man who has given himself over to every lust be a citizen according to the Law of God when the Lord has declared, "I say, you shall not lust"? Is a person to take a decision to sin deliberately, and to lay it down as a principle to commit adultery, to waste his substance in high living, and to break up other people’s marriages, when we actually pity the rest who fall involuntarily into sin? Even if they have arrived in an alien world, if they prove unfaithful in what belongs to another, they will have no hold on the truth. Does a foreigner insult the citizens? Do them wrong? Does he not rather behave as a visitor and live out his life in conformity with the regulations without offending the citizens? How can they say that they are the only people with a knowledge of God when they behave in the same way as those the gentiles hate for their failure to obey the laws’ injunctions – criminals, immoralists, the avaricious, and adulterers? They ought to be living virtuous lives in a foreign land too, so as to show that they really are of royal blood.

As it is, they have taken the decision to live lawlessly, and won the hatred alike of human legislators and of the Law of God. At any rate, the man who speared through the fornicator in Numbers is shown to be blessed by God. "If we say," says John in his letter, "that we have communion with him" – that is, God – "and walk in darkness, we are lying and not acting out the truth. If we walk in the light as he is in the light, then we enjoy communion with him, and the blood of his son Jesus cleanses us from sin." How then are those who behave in this manner superior to the worldly? They are like the dregs of the worldly. Like acts reveal like natures, I suppose. Those who claim superiority of birth ought to show superiority of character, if they want to escape incarceration in prison. It really is as the Lord said: "If your righteousness does not exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will not enter the kingdom of God." Scripture shows in Daniel the principle of abstinence in food. To sum up, David in the Psalms speaks about obedience: "How shall a young man keep his path straight?" The answer comes immediately: "By keeping your Word with his whole heart." Jeremiah says, "These are the Lord’s words: do not follow the paths of the gentiles." (Strom 3.30 - 33)

We have no intention of making a closer examination of this topic or mentioning more implausible heresies. We have no intention of being forced to an individual discussion of each of them in all their scandalous nature or prolonging these notes to a vast length. Let us answer them by dividing all the heresies into two groups. Either they teach a way of life which makes no distinction between right and wrong or their hymn is too highly strung and they acclaim asceticism out of a spirit of irreligious quarrelsomeness. I must first expound the former division. If it is legitimate to choose any way of life, then clearly it is legitimate to choose the way that involves asceticism. If there is no way of life which carries danger for the elect, then clearly this is particularly true of the life of virtuous self-discipline. If the Lord of the sabbath has been granted freedom from accountability for a life of licentiousness, the man whose social life is orderly will be far freer from accountability. The Apostle says, "Everything is legitimate for me; not everything is expedient." If everything is legitimate, that obviously includes self-discipline.

So just as the person who uses his legitimate choice to live a virtuous life is worthy of praise, so the one who gives us this free and sovereign right of legitimate choice, allowing us to live as we wish, is far more to be reverenced and honored in not allowing our positive or negative choices to fall into inescapable slavery. Neither has occasion for fear from the choice of license or discipline; but they are not held in the same respect. The person who drifts into pleasures is gratifying his body; the ascetic is freeing his soul from passions, and the soul has authority over the body. If they tell us that we are called to freedom, we are not, as the Apostle puts it, to present that "freedom as an opening for our lower selves." If we are to gratify lust, if we are to think a reprehensible way of living a matter of moral indifference, as they assert, either we ought to obey our lusts at all points and, if so, to engage in the most immoral and irreligious practices in conformity with our teachers, or we shall turn away from some of our desires, no longer compelled to live by amoral standards, no longer in unbridled servitude to our least honorable parts – stomach and sex-organs – pampering our carcass to serve our desire. Lust is nurtured and vitalized if we minister to its enjoyment; on the other hand, it fades away if it is kept in check. (Strom 3.40 - 41)

In that case there is not left ground for even examining what one prefers— the menaces of man or the love of God. And abstinence from vicious acts is found, somehow, [to result in] the diminution and extinction of vicious propensities, their energy being destroyed by inaction. And this is the import of Sell what you have, and give to the poor, and come, follow Me Matthew 19:21 — that is, follow what is said by the Lord. Some say that by what you have He designated the things in the soul, of a nature not akin to it, though how these are bestowed on the poor they are not able to say. For God dispenses to all according to desert, His distribution being righteous. Despising, therefore, the possessions which God apportions to you in your magnificence, comply with what is spoken by me; haste to the ascent of the Spirit, being not only justified by abstinence from what is evil, but in addition also perfected, by Christlike beneficence. In this instance He convicted the man, who boasted that he had fulfilled the injunctions of the law, of not loving his neighbour; and it is by beneficence that the love which, according to the gnostic ascending scale, is Lord of the Sabbath, proclaims itself. We must then, according to my view, have recourse to the word of salvation neither from fear of punishment nor promise of a gift, but on account of the good itself. (Strom 4.29)
The saying seems to be consistently used by heretics in the Marcionite sense - i.e. as a way of saying the Christian was free from the obligations of following the Law.
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Re: Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

Post by Kunigunde Kreuzerin »

Stephan Huller wrote:It seems counterintuitive not to see two genitives being joined by the καὶ and modifying υἱὸς.
Yes, that is exactly the point. It seems that without context no one would translate with "is Lord even of the Sabbath". :mrgreen:

Stephan Huller wrote:I think they take the greater context of the passage as decisive.
Yes. For a fair discussion I will try to put forward a counter-argument. I think that an important issue in Mark 1:21–2:12 is the authority of Jesus, the ”ἐξουσία“ (exousia). In Mark 2:1–3:6 Jesus comes into conflict with religious traditions and commandments and so his authority is questioned. I find it interesting that the Pharisees in Mark 2:24 - and Jesus himself in Mark 3:4 - used the verb “ἔξεστιν” (exestin) for "lawful" that you also may translate as “authorized.” It would make sense that Jesus emphasizes and proves his authority about the Sabbath. So he does in Mark 2:10 with his authority to forgive sins: “But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins ..” Comparable would be Mark 2:28 (emphasizes his authority about the Sabbath) and Mark 3:1-6 (proves his authority about the Sabbath). In this context the translation “Lord even of the Sabbath” make sense.
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Re: Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

Post by theomise »

From what I understand of Greek grammar, I don't think it is possible to read 2:28 as referring to a "son of the Sabbath" rather than "lord of the Sabbath".

Further, keep in mind that "Son of Man" would have been rendered in nomina sacra, not spelled out. That makes the proposed reading even more torturous.

Finally, the overall context is the delineation of the Son of Man's powers. Consider the grammatical parallel with 2:10:

2:10: ... εξουσιαν εχει ο υιος του ανθρωπου αφιεναι αμαρτιας επι της γης ...
2:10: "... Authority has the Son of Man to forgive sins on the earth..."

2:28: ... κυριος εστιν ο υιος του ανθρωπου και του σαββατου
2:28: "... Lord is the Son of Man even of the Sabbath"
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Re: Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

Post by Kunigunde Kreuzerin »

theomise wrote:From what I understand of Greek grammar, I don't think it is possible to read 2:28 as referring to a "son of the Sabbath" ...
Why?

theomise wrote:Further, keep in mind that "Son of Man" would have been rendered in nomina sacra, not spelled out. That makes the proposed reading even more torturous.
No, this is not the case or the word position is still clearly.

Codex Bezae Mark 2:28
Image

Codex Sinaiticus Mark 2:28
Image


theomise wrote:Finally, the overall context is the delineation of the Son of Man's powers. Consider the grammatical parallel with 2:10:

2:10: ... εξουσιαν εχει ο υιος του ανθρωπου αφιεναι αμαρτιας επι της γης ...
2:10: "... Authority has the Son of Man to forgive sins on the earth..."

2:28: ... κυριος εστιν ο υιος του ανθρωπου και του σαββατου
2:28: "... Lord is the Son of Man even of the Sabbath"
Yes, that is the counterargument put forward by myself.
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Re: Mark 2:28 Son of the Sabbath or Lord of the Sabbath?

Post by Stephan Huller »

I think the heretical exegesis I cited assumes that Jesus healed someone and that man became "son of man" the "lord of sabbaths"
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