gMark: provenance

[Adam]

Matthew's notes of Jesus became the Aramaic portion of Q/Twelve-Source, John Mark wrote the Passion Narrative as a diary. He obtained Peter's account for the Greek-original portion of the Proto-Gospel he wrote in 44 AD. This was expanded to Proto-Luke incorporating L. This was used by Marcion and for Proto-Matthew adding M. This evolved farther into gMatthew and abridged into gMark.
The Passion Narrative was expanded by Andrew's Signs Source and Nicodemus's Discourses into the first edition of John, only the Signs Source originating in Greek. John edited and added his testimony.

[Adam]

So there you go, gmx! 99 words, maybe 100. As a teenager I had a talent for (and limitation to) intense condensation, synopsis. I resurrected it above.

Where to find elaborations of my Horizontal Synoptic Solution? I made a thread of that title, but it mostly develops the refinements beyond the seven sources to how they were put together. Earlier I had a thread titled "Ur-Marcan Priority? Or Inner Circle?" In it Peter Kirby kindly copied over my Thesis in a post under HIS name with the notation, "These are obviously not my ideas!" He obtained this material from my thread in Christian Forums. To find that there, go to ChristianForums.org and search for "Gospel Eyewitnesses" There are two threads by me (known there as "Korah"--the rebel against Moses), choose the longer one in "Unorthodox Theology" to read it, but if you post there best to use the one in General Theology (where people will read it). I can't give you guys a link or more accurate descriptions of how to get to my stuff because I am currently under 6-month ban at Christian Forums and here in Peter-Kirby-land I can't work the Search feature. Wish I could access my stuff by my threads. Didn't we used to?

My Thesis was also presented in Freethought and Rationalism Discussion Board, to a chorus of insults fired at me. I still wonder whether my Thesis so refuting both Atheism and anti-Christianity led to the demise of the website. The owners were doing all kinds of somersaults to limit or erase our sub-forum there.
I derived my Thesis on Theology Web, but all those posts were lost in the massive computer crash in 2013--but perhaps recoverable in the Wayback Machine.

[Adam]

OK, I failed. In 100 words I got in six written eyewitness accounts about Jesus, not seven. I forgot my own long-standing discovery that Proto-Luke was written by Simon, the son of Cleopas, the future second Bishop of Jerusalem. So after "Proto-Luke" I would add "by Simon" and to keep within 100 words drop the "by Marcion" a few words later in the very next sentence. Unfortunately that leaves unexplained who this "Simon" was. And the "by Marcion" is too juicy within this Forum to delete.
I would also like to add in the derivation of the Gospel of the Hebrews. After the "abridged into gMark" I would add "and the original Proto-Gospel was reworked to add back in the L material in Proto-Luke as a basis for the Gospel of the Hebrews." But that adds 26 words and is supererogatory.

[gmx]

OK, I failed. In 100 words I got in six written eyewitness accounts about Jesus, not seven.

Adam, the 100-word limit was kind of figurative. It was long-hand for "briefly". The cover sheet requirement was less rubbery, and thus you fail on that score alone.

However, thanks for your reply. I'll do some further research using the links / references you've provided, before considering any sort of response, other than the say the "Matthew's early notes in Aramaic" idea is one that has certainly done the rounds, and IMO has a lot going for it.

[Adam]

Yes, gmx,
I was just "playing ball", I would have insisted on 200 or 300 words if I had felt I could say nothing in 100 words. Thanks for challenging me to put up or shut up. Were you able to find "Gospel Eyewitnesses" at ChristianForums.org ? I never had trouble, but maybe my own computer had a tag for it.
If necessary I can find where Peter Kirby edited those ten(?) posts to one right here in this forum, "Ur-Marcan Priority? Or Inner circle?" As I said, the Horizontal Synoptic Solution goes into the further foray into solving the Synoptic Question. My "Gospel Eyewitnesses" Thesis of seven written eyewitness accounts of Jesus does not get into solving the Synoptic Question, but implicitly accepts some of the wrong Consensus views.

As for DebatingChristianity, I played cat-and-mouse with them and never really presented my Thesis before I got permanently banned. They never explained either my suspension nor the next day permanent ban nor do they respond to my monthly request for redetermination of my termination. They claim (once they did answer) that they don't monitor webmaster@debatingchristianity.org , but the boss Otseng replied once telling me to log an inquiry by signing in (in effect) though I've been banned and can't sign in! What's wrong with them--Otseng personally does all bans.

[Peter Kirby]

If necessary I can find where Peter Kirby edited those ten(?) posts to one right here in this forum, "Ur-Marcan Priority? Or Inner circle?"

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=14&p=495&hilit=#p495

[Blood]

Most scholars seem to accept a Roman provenance for the Gospel of Mark, regardless of their respective views on Markan priority.

Assuming Markan priority, what does it mean / imply that the first and most influential Christian Gospel (given its use by Matthew and Luke) was composed in a land far, far away from the Palestinian events it describes?

It means that Roman religious intellectuals with a copy of the LXX are the originators of Christianity.

Suetonius has Christians in Rome in 50, Tacitus has them there in the same period, and Josephus's works, which were hugely influential on Christian writers, would have been most readily available where he wrote them -- Rome.

This is why Peter and Paul must come to Rome. Not because they really did, but the writers wanted their religion to be "authentic," and to be authentic they needed to have a pseudo-historical origin story of a "Jerusalem church" and a Galilean sect, all of which mysterious vanish from Christian consciousness once the leading figures make their pilgrimmage to Rome. There is no reason for them to come to Rome except for narrative purposes.

[Adam]

Thanks, Peter (Kirby),
At least YOU cared enough to bring over my "stuff" neatly here (though some elements, particularly regarding "Greek Q", are in pencil, so to speak). For those not in the know, however, the THESE ARE OBVIOUSLY NOT MY IDEAS!" means he's blaming them (correctly) on me.
But as I said, gmx, NOBODY (except Kirby, apparently) cares.