"XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Discussion about the New Testament, apocrypha, gnostics, church fathers, Christian origins, historical Jesus or otherwise, etc.
Secret Alias
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"XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Post by Secret Alias »

κἀν τῇ πρὸς Κολασσαεῖς ἐπιστολῇ νουθετοῦντες γράφει πάντα ἄνθρωπον καὶ διδάσκοντες ἐν πάσῃ σοφίᾳ, ἵνα παραστήσωμεν πάντα ἄν1.1.16.1 θρωπον τέλειον ἐν Χριστῷ. ἁρμόζει δὲ καὶ ἄλλως τῇ τῶν ὑπομνημάτων ὑποτυπώσει τὸ γλαφυρὸν τῆς θεωρίας. αὐτίκα καὶ ἡ τῆς χρηστομαθίας περιουσία οἷον ἥδυσμά τί ἐστιν παραπεπλεγμένον ἀθλητοῦ βρώματι, οὐ τρυφητιῶντος, ὄρεξιν δὲ ἀγαθὴν <διὰ> φιλοτιμίαν λαμβάνοντος. [Stromata 1.1.16.1]

Also in the Epistle to the Colossians he writes, "Admonishing every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ." The nicety of speculation, too, suits the sketch presented in my commentaries. In this respect the chrestomathy are like a relish mixed with the food of an athlete, who is not indulging in luxury, but entertains a noble desire for distinction.
Chrestomathy (/krɛsˈtɒməθi/ kres-tom-ə-thee; from the Ancient Greek χρηστομάθεια “desire of learning” = χρηστός “useful” + μανθάνω “learn”) is a collection of choice literary passages, used especially as an aid in learning a subject.

In philology or in the study of literature, it is a type of reader which presents a sequence of example texts, selected to demonstrate the development of language or literary style. It is different from an anthology because of its didactic purpose.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Re: "XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Post by Secret Alias »

The first mention of 'XC' in the Stromata 1.1.3.3 is another play on chrestos:
And now the Saviour shows Himself, out of His abundance, dispensing goods to His servants according to the ability of the recipient, that they may augment them by exercising activity, and then returning to reckon with them; when, approving of those that had increased His money, those faithful in little, and commanding them to have the charge over many things, He bade them enter into the joy of the Lord. But to him who had hid the money, entrusted to him to be given out at interest, and had given it back as he had received it, without increase, He said, "Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou oughtest to have given my money to the bankers, and at my coming I should have received mine own." Wherefore the useless servant "shall be cast into outer darkness." "Thou, therefore, be strong," says Paul, "in the grace that is in Christ Jesus. And the things which thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also."

ἐπὶ τούτοις ὁ ἀχρεῖος δοῦλος εἰς τὸ ἐξώτερον ἐμβληθήσεται σκότος. σὺ οὖν ἐνδυναμοῦ, καὶ Παῦλος λέγει, ἐν χάριτι τῇ ἐν Χριστῷ Ἰησοῦ, καὶ ἃ ἤκουσας παρ' ἐμοῦ διὰ πολλῶν μαρτύρων.
This situation has long been noted by scholars as one notes in a commentary on Paed. 3.8.:
Clement maintains that the message of classical literature can relate to the life of a Christian and he quotes a text
later used by Basil. He states:
‘some men being instructed are saved; and others, self-taught, either aspire after or seek virtue.
“He truly is the best of all who himself perceives all things.”
Such is Abraham, who sought God.
“And good, again, is he who obeys him who advises well.”
Such are those disciples who obeyed the Word. Wherefore the former was called “friend,” the
latter “apostles;” the one diligently seeking, and the other preaching one and the same God. And
both are peoples, and both these have hearers, the one who is profited through seeking, the other
who is saved through finding.
“But whoever neither himself perceives, nor, hearing another Lays to heart—he is a worthless man.”
The other people is the Gentile—useless; this is the people that followeth not Christ.’134

Clement quotes Hesiod, Works and Days 293-297, a pagan text, but provides Christian examples of the types of man that Hesiod describes. The man who identifies the best course for himself is like Abraham, the man who responds to instruction is like the disciples who were taught by Christ, and the useless man, who does not see for himself nor will learn from others, refers to those who do not follow Christ.

135 Ὃς δέ κε μήτ’ αὐτὸς νοέῃ μήτ’ ἄλλου ἀκούων / ἐν θυμῷ βάλληται, ὃ δ’ αὖτ’ ἀχρήιος
ἀνήρ. Λαὸς ἄλλος ἐστίν, ἐθνικὸς ἀχρεῖος οὗτος ὁ λαὸς ὁ μὴ Χριστῷ ἑπόμενος. It seems likely
that in his exposition of Hesiod’s text Clement is punning on the Greek words for worthless ἀχρεῖος)
and Christ (Χριστός). There was a tradition of punning on the name Christ from the earliest days of the
church, for further discussion see Thomas Scott Caulley, "The Chrestos/Christos Pun (1 Pet 2:3) in P72
and P125," Novum Testamentum 53, no. 4 (2011) and John Moles, "Jesus the Healer in the Gospels, the
Acts of the Apostles, and Early Christianity," Histos 5 (2011)
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Re: "XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Post by Secret Alias »

This can't just be a 'clever play on words' on Clement's part. Above all else the Savior is actually literally named Xrestos not Xristos. He is the 'useful one' the good one rather than the anointed one. There is no connection with Jewish messianic expectations in any of this.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
John2
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Re: "XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Post by John2 »

It's been awhile since I followed the Chrestian breadcrumb trail, but where I left it was with Bartram pointing the finger at Antonia Minor as being a ringleader of sorts to a class of people who were "Chestians" (or proto-Christians), without a connection to Jewish Messianism, though a blending eventually occurred from contact with people like Philo's brother Alexander the Alabarch and nephew Tiberius Alexander (who were associated with Egpyt, like Clement of Alexandria), Herodians, Paul and Josephus. But I'm open to re-examining the issue.

https://sites.google.com/site/originsof ... onia-minor
You know in spite of all you gained, you still have to stand out in the pouring rain.
Secret Alias
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Re: "XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Post by Secret Alias »

You like provoking me ...
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Re: "XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Post by Secret Alias »

The pairing of XC and ἤπιος. For instance in Strom 1.1.6.3:
It therefore follows, that every one of those who undertake to promote the good of their neighbours, ought to consider whether he has betaken himself to teaching rashly and out of rivalry to any; if his communication of the word is out of vainglory; if the t only reward he reaps is the salvation of those who hear, and if he speaks not in order to win favour: if so, he who speaks by writings escapes the reproach of mercenary motives. "For neither at any time used we flattering words, as ye know," says the apostle, "nor a cloak of covetousness. God is witness. Nor of men sought we glory, neither of you, nor yet of others, when we might have been burdensome as the apostles of Christ. But we were gentle among you, even as a nurse cherisheth her children." In the same way, therefore, those who take part in the divine words, ought to guard against betaking themselves to this, as they would to the building of cities, to examine them out of curiosity; that they do not come to the task for the sake of receiving worldly things, having ascertained that they who are consecrated to Christ are given to communicate the necessaries of life.

σκοπεῖσθαι οὖν ἀκόλουθον ἄρα τῷ τὴν ὠφέλειαν τῶν πλησίον ἐπανῃρημένῳ, εἰ μὴ θρασέως καί τισιν ἀντιζηλούμενος ἐπεπήδησεν τῇ διδασκαλίᾳ, εἰ μὴ φιλόδοξος ἡ κοινωνία τοῦ λόγου, εἰ τοῦτον μόνον καρποῦται τὸν μισθόν, τὴν σωτηρίαν τῶν ἐπαϊόντων, τό τε μὴ πρὸς χάριν ὁμιλεῖν δωροδοκίας 1.1.6.2 τε αὖ διαβολὴν διαπέφευγεν ὁ δι' ὑπομνημάτων λαλῶν· οὔτε γάρ ποτε ἐν λόγῳ κολακείας ἐγενήθημεν, καθὼς οἴδατε, φησὶν ὁ ἀπόστολος, οὔτε προφάσει πλεονεξίας, θεὸς μάρτυς, οὔτε ζητοῦντες ἐξ ἀνθρώπων δόξαν, οὔτε ἀφ' ὑμῶν οὔτε ἀπ' ἄλλων. δυνάμενοι ἐν βάρει εἶναι ὡς Χριστοῦ ἀπόστολοι· ἀλλ' ἐγενήθημεν ἤπιοι ἐν μέσῳ ὑμῶν, ὡς ἂν τροφὸς θάλπῃ τὰ ἑαυτῆς τέκνα. κατὰ ταὐτὰ δὲ καὶ τοὺς τῶν θείων μεταλαμβάνοντας λόγων παραφυλακτέον, εἰ μὴ περιεργίας ἕνεκεν ἱστορήσοντες, ὥσπερ τῶν πόλεων τὰ οἰκοδομήματα, εἰς τόδε ἀφικνοῦνται, εἰ μὴ μεταλήψεως χάριν τῶν κοσμικῶν προσίασιν κοινωνικοὺς τῶν ἐπιτηδείων μαθόντες τοὺς καθωσιωμένους τῷ Χριστῷ.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
John2
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Re: "XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Post by John2 »

Not at all. I'm very reluctant to provoke you, but at the same time I think you're a smart person and sometimes you bring up subjects -in this case the use of Chrest- that I'm interested in and make me want to respond.
You know in spite of all you gained, you still have to stand out in the pouring rain.
Secret Alias
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Re: "XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Post by Secret Alias »

But why would the best place to start to find a solution to this topic be in the place(s) you suggested? It would seem to me a projection on you part. As if you want to look there because a pre-existent idee fixee. My next thread may be of more interest.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:47 am

Re: "XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Post by Secret Alias »

Strom 2.4.18.3

In The Statesman he says expressly, "So that the knowledge of the true king is kingly; and he who possesses it, whether a prince or private person, shall by all means, in consequence of this act, be rightly styled royal." Now those who have believed in Christ both are and are called Chrestoi (noble), as those who are cared for by the true king are kingly. For as the wise are wise by their wisdom, and those observant of law are so by the law; so also those who belong to Christ the King are kings, and those that are Christ's Christians.

ὥστε ἡ τοῦ ἀληθινοῦ βασιλέως ἐπιστήμη βασιλική, καὶ ὁ ταύτην κεκτημένος, ἐάν τε ἄρχων ἐάν τε ἰδιώτης ὢν τυγχάνῃ, πάντως κατά γε τὴν τέχνην αὐτὴν βασιλικὸς ὀρθῶς προσαγορευθήσεται. αὐτίκα οἱ εἰς τὸν Χριστὸν πεπιστευκότες χρηστοί τε εἰσὶ καὶ λέγονται, ὡς τῷ ὄντι βασιλικοὶ οἱ βασιλεῖ μεμελημένοι. ὡς γὰρ οἱ σοφοὶ σοφίᾳ εἰσὶ σοφοὶ καὶ οἱ νόμιμοι νόμῳ νόμιμοι, οὕτως οἱ Χριστῷ βασιλεῖ βασιλεῖς καὶ οἱ Χριστοῦ Χριστιανοί
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:47 am

Re: "XC" For Clement was Xrestos not Xristos

Post by Secret Alias »

Strom 1.25.166.5 - 1.26.168.1

And the law is not what is decided by law (for what is seen is not vision), nor every opinion (not certainly what is evil). But law is the opinion which is good, and what is good is that which is true, and what is true is that which finds "true being," and attains to it. "He who is," says Moses, "sent me." In accordance with which, namely, good opinion, some have called law, right reason, which enjoins what is to be done and forbids what is not to be done.

νόμος δέ ἐστιν οὐ τὰ νομιζόμενα (οὐδὲ γὰρ τὰ ὁρώμενα ὅρασις) οὐδὲ δόξα πᾶσα (οὐ γὰρ καὶ ἡ πονηρά), ἀλλὰ νόμος ἐστὶ χρηστὴ δόξα, χρηστὴ δὲ ἡ ἀληθής, ἀληθὴς δὲ ἡ τὸ ὂν εὑρίσκουσα καὶ τούτου τυγχάνουσα· ὁ ὢν δὲ ἐξαπέσταλκέν με, φησὶν ὁ Μωυσῆς. ᾗ τινες ἀκολούθως δηλονότι τῇ χρηστῇ δόξῃ λόγον ὀρθὸν τὸν νόμον ἔφασαν, προστακτικὸν μὲν ὧν ποιητέον. ἀπαγορευτικὸν δὲ ὧν οὐ ποιητέον.

Whence the law was rightly said to have been given by Moses, being a rule of fight and wrong; and we may call it with accuracy the divine ordinance (qesmos, inasmuch as it was given by God through Moses. It accordingly conducts to the divine. Paul says: "The law was instituted because of transgressions, till the seed should come, to whom the promise was made." Then, as if in explanation of his meaning, he adds: "But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up," manifestly through fear, in consequence of sins, "unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed; so that the law was a schoolmaster to bring us to Christ, that we should be justified by faith." The true legislator is he who assigns to each department of the soul what is suitable to it and to its operations. Now Moses, to speak comprehensively, was a living law, governed by the benign Word.

ὥστε ὁ νόμος παιδαγωγὸς ἡμῶν ἐγένετο εἰς Χριστόν, ἵνα ἐκ πίστεως 1.26.167.3 δικαιωθῶμεν. ὁ νομοθετικὸς δέ ἐστιν ὁ τὸ προσῆκον ἑκάστῳ μέρει τῆς ψυχῆς καὶ τοῖς τούτων ἔργοις ἀπονέμων, Μωυσῆς δὲ συνελόντι εἰπεῖν νόμος ἔμψυχος ἦν τῷ χρηστῷ λόγῳ κυβερνώμενος. πολιτείαν γοῦν διηκόνησεν ἀγαθήν·
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
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