Search found 9653 matches

by Giuseppe
Wed Oct 20, 2021 11:46 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France
Replies: 13
Views: 127

Re: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France

Maybe, but that's a matter of preference. The question simply does no arise in my thinking. If we can know nothing about the author then that's the end of that. Well, on this point I would like to follow Carrier when he says that, given even only one change in our knowledge of background, we are ju...
by Giuseppe
Wed Oct 20, 2021 11:30 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France
Replies: 13
Views: 127

Re: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France

But we don't find a Jesus like that after removing the Marcionite and Catholic layers in T's view. Read the normal sized font in italics in his letters at the end of the commentaries and there is no such Jesus to be found. True, but it also true that in whiletime we have added new knowledge (by rem...
by Giuseppe
Wed Oct 20, 2021 11:25 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France
Replies: 13
Views: 127

Re: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France

If I understand you correctly, I think you are comparing T's paring down the epistles to find the "real Paul" with paring away the myth in the gospels to find the "real Jesus". Why do you use the term 'paring down' with reference to Paul ? I can understand you when you refer the...
by Giuseppe
Wed Oct 20, 2021 11:12 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France
Replies: 13
Views: 127

Re: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France

I think you have read far more into my comment than I ever thought to express or at any time ever imagined. I was responding specifically, directly, solely and even explicitly to Turmel's seeing the historical Jesus as a Joan of Arc figure. But that view of the historical Jesus as a rebel (and in p...
by Giuseppe
Wed Oct 20, 2021 9:33 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France
Replies: 13
Views: 127

Re: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France

I don't read Turmel in that way (i.e. by comparing him to the Christian apologist James McGrath), but rather in the way Roger Parvus has read Turmel, i.e. well exemplified by this RG Price's comment: Color me skeptical. Firstly, anyone claiming to be able to identify “the real Paul” is already an bi...
by Giuseppe
Wed Oct 20, 2021 9:17 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Dave Allen: an analysis
Replies: 6
Views: 109

Re: Dave Allen: an analysis

and, as you later correct Allen rightly, the passage immediately following isn't a "rebel passage," being a calamity of another sort possibly I may be wrong also on that, since, possibly, Allen may interpret the incipit of the passage immediately following "After another disgrace put...
by Giuseppe
Wed Oct 20, 2021 11:22 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France
Replies: 13
Views: 127

Turmel: Jesus undertook to do in Palestine what, fifteen centuries later, Joan of Arc did in France

Les rêcits et les oracles évangéliques se rangent en deux groupes qui se contredisent, dont l'un seul peut être historique, dont l'autre appartien nécessairement au domaine de la fiction. Et l'oeil exercé a vite fait d'identifier ces groupes dont l'un est occupé exclusivement par les fictions. Fict...
by Giuseppe
Tue Oct 19, 2021 11:37 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Dave Allen arguing for a genuine Testimonium Flavianum: a criticism
Replies: 47
Views: 1517

Re: Dave Allen arguing for a genuine Testimonium Flavianum: a criticism

Eisenman pointed out this 'coincidence', also. So a commenter of his book on Amazon: A Samaritan Messiah described as "the son of Joseph" also seemed to have existed (pp.101-106) and was reportedly crucified by Pontius Pilate (see Eisenman's preface, p.xxiii). The author also points out th...
by Giuseppe
Tue Oct 19, 2021 12:01 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Dave Allen arguing for a genuine Testimonium Flavianum: a criticism
Replies: 47
Views: 1517

Re: Dave Allen arguing for a genuine Testimonium Flavianum: a criticism

My reluctance to accept a partially authentic negative TF derives from the presence of the passage about the Samaritan false prophet slain by Pilate, where we have the incredible "coincidence" of a "Messiah Son of Joseph" (remember that the Samaritans claimed to be "descenda...
by Giuseppe
Tue Oct 19, 2021 11:38 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Dave Allen arguing for a genuine Testimonium Flavianum: a criticism
Replies: 47
Views: 1517

Re: Dave Allen arguing for a genuine Testimonium Flavianum: a criticism

My correction: More precisely, Boistier thinks that originally Josephus had written only the cruel acts of Pilate against the Jews, followed by his final repression of the Samaritan tumult. Then, in a second moment, the Christians interpolated the episode of the antinomian Jew deceiver working in Ro...