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by Giuseppe
Wed Dec 01, 2021 7:45 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: The forgotten third Christian movement
Replies: 18
Views: 357

Re: The forgotten third Christian movement

If Paul was preaching that the Creator was not the Father, then we have a pretty clear answer as to why Marcion was interested in Paul. I don't think that such an indication still exists in the Catholic form of the letters. If it ever existed, it doesn't any more. a curiosity: are you arrived to su...
by Giuseppe
Tue Nov 30, 2021 10:07 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: The forgotten third Christian movement
Replies: 18
Views: 357

Re: The forgotten third Christian movement

My little contribute to any scenario that assumes Gnostics coming before any "Jewish"/Catholic thing is put in the following thread (it has to be read entirely to understand better my point): https://earlywritings.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=113655#p113655 Essentially, the skeleton of any P...
by Giuseppe
Tue Nov 30, 2021 12:29 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: On the expulsion of Jesus by the Jews according to Hierocles
Replies: 0
Views: 43

On the expulsion of Jesus by the Jews according to Hierocles

Hierocles claims that Christ was expelled by the Jews, collected 900 men and committed robberies (Lactantius, Inst . 5.3.4). The Toledoth Yeschu claims the same thing, only it reports that, after the expulsion, Jesus collected 12 evil people and not 900 men. Now, it is a fact that precisely the Gos...
by Giuseppe
Mon Nov 29, 2021 12:45 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: On "the men as trees walking" as a prophecy of destruction
Replies: 1
Views: 58

Re: On "the men as trees walking" as a prophecy of destruction

Mark 11:20-21:

In the morning, as they went along, they saw the fig tree withered from the roots. Peter remembered and said to Jesus, “Rabbi, look! The fig tree you cursed has withered!”

by Giuseppe
Mon Nov 29, 2021 12:41 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: On "the men as trees walking" as a prophecy of destruction
Replies: 1
Views: 58

On "the men as trees walking" as a prophecy of destruction

And he looked up, and said, I see men as trees, walking (Mark 8:24) III. 1 But the son of Annas the scribe was standing there with Joseph; and he took a branch of a willow and dispersed the waters which Jesus had gathered together. 2 And when Jesus saw what was done, he was wroth and said unto him:...
by Giuseppe
Sun Nov 28, 2021 1:02 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Does the ʺearthly kingdomʺ hypothesis imply necessarily a historical Jesus?
Replies: 15
Views: 299

Re: Does the ʺearthly kingdomʺ hypothesis imply necessarily a historical Jesus?

Georgios Sidirountios's thesis is available here: there is a chapter arguing for early Christian texts having particular hostility against the Greeks as people inter alia (meaning not all the Gentiles, but the ethnic Greeks).
by Giuseppe
Sat Nov 27, 2021 10:39 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: New thoughts on the Book of Revelation
Replies: 27
Views: 569

Re: New thoughts on the Book of Revelation

E.P.Sanders and W.D.Davies would agree with the logic of Gmirkin's argument: ‘The entire teaching material which is attributed to Jesus points away from his being a revolutionary in a way that would actually have threatened Rome. Either the evangelists have not only invented the Jewish trial scenes,...
by Giuseppe
Sat Nov 27, 2021 10:04 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: New thoughts on the Book of Revelation
Replies: 27
Views: 569

Re: New thoughts on the Book of Revelation

Thanks to Russell for this exhaustive answer: I would view Jesus as “teacher” to mean someone bringing wisdom, enlightenment, and ethical truths on a theoretical level. It is common to portray Jesus as a teacher, like a sort of wandering Cynic philosopher. The gospels indeed promote this sort of ima...
by Giuseppe
Sat Nov 27, 2021 9:47 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Does the ʺearthly kingdomʺ hypothesis imply necessarily a historical Jesus?
Replies: 15
Views: 299

Re: Does the ʺearthly kingdomʺ hypothesis imply necessarily a historical Jesus?

In my view (and Gmirkin's view I think), if a Christian text symphatizes with the Zealots of the besieged and expugned Jerusalem (see Gmirkin's comments for the argument), then that Christian text is evidence of Jewish-Christians going deliberately against the Pax Romana , and not only against the P...
by Giuseppe
Sat Nov 27, 2021 12:53 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: The precise point about Paul where Georgios Sidirountios meets Joseph Turmel
Replies: 0
Views: 57

The precise point about Paul where Georgios Sidirountios meets Joseph Turmel

The other problem in testing the historicity of these reports is that Paul appears to be preaching for the resurrected rather than for the pre‑resurrected Jesus. I have also analysed in the first Chapter that the resurrected Jesus was unknown in the earliest texts of Matthew and Mark, and the quest...