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by neilgodfrey
Sat Mar 02, 2024 4:48 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously
Replies: 89
Views: 2114

Re: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously

The proposal that during the Persian period Priests at Jerusalem and Israelites in Palestine as a whole had developed their ancient traditions into two different extended narratives and that in the very early Hellenistic period after the breakdown of Persian overlordship both these narratives were ...
by neilgodfrey
Sat Mar 02, 2024 3:43 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously
Replies: 89
Views: 2114

Re: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously

And one more little detail, if I may, as a follow up to my earlier point about engaging with intellectual discussion independently of any notion of contesting/defending personal identities... There is one scholar whose work on Elephantine I have found most interesting and I have devoured almost ever...
by neilgodfrey
Sat Mar 02, 2024 3:37 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously
Replies: 89
Views: 2114

Re: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously

Reflecting on an earlier point of mine that I think was perhaps not explained well enough. I wrote: That applies to all archaeological reconstructions. But other historians rarely nowadays try to save some narrative core in a good ancient story in the same way biblical scholars seem often to try to ...
by neilgodfrey
Sat Mar 02, 2024 3:25 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously
Replies: 89
Views: 2114

Re: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously

One General issue is that the works in the Old Testament that would often be regarded as early Hellenistic like Chronicles are revising an earlier pre-Hellenistic text (Samuel-Kings) in the light of later ideology. (Yes this does treat Samuel-Kings as pre-Hellenistic but it does IMO seem considerab...
by neilgodfrey
Sat Mar 02, 2024 3:18 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously
Replies: 89
Views: 2114

Re: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously

I think we may have to clarify what exactly a Hellenistic origin for the Pentateuch means. I agree that the present canonical form of the MT of the Pentateuch is Hellenistic, not just in trivial points but in that the detailed chronology of the MT which is important in final form exegesis is Hellen...
by neilgodfrey
Sat Mar 02, 2024 12:10 am
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously
Replies: 89
Views: 2114

Re: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously

One General issue is that the works in the Old Testament that would often be regarded as early Hellenistic like Chronicles are revising an earlier pre-Hellenistic text (Samuel-Kings) in the light of later ideology. (Yes this does treat Samuel-Kings as pre-Hellenistic but it does IMO seem considerab...
by neilgodfrey
Fri Mar 01, 2024 11:50 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously
Replies: 89
Views: 2114

Re: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously

The classical demonstration that intellectuals can and do engage in scholarly pursuits potentially independently of subliminally defending or promoting "identity" issues is the conference. Or at least the conference of, by and for professionals stands as a witness to the larger irrelevance...
by neilgodfrey
Fri Mar 01, 2024 7:06 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously
Replies: 89
Views: 2114

Re: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously

When in my OP I wrote . . . Biblical scholars, it is no secret to anyone, not even to themselves on the whole, do have interests that go beyond pure historical research. Even Julius Wellhausen, to whom we tend to attribute the modern notion of the "Documentary Hypothesis", has been critici...
by neilgodfrey
Fri Mar 01, 2024 5:05 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously
Replies: 89
Views: 2114

Re: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously

Here is a crux of the matter. I raised it in another discussion in relation to the Flood narrative in Genesis. Imagine a redactor, R, familiar with source A. R discovers a second source, B, about the same event. R has a certain ideological viewpoint that A has illustrated in some fashion. B does not...
by neilgodfrey
Fri Mar 01, 2024 4:53 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously
Replies: 89
Views: 2114

Re: Why the Hellenistic era for ALL "Old Testament" books should be taken seriously

Given the acceptance of that observation, I suggest that it is relevant and does "affect the debate." In other words, it is a widely-recognized model of known traditions. As an option, surely it is a better model than supposing that the Torah-community (or communities) had no form of writ...