Biblical Criticism & History Forum - earlywritings.com

Bernard Muller wrote:Are the English translations so wrong that the underlying Greek, if I could read it, would change my mind?

So.... you really do believe that you can gauge the style of a Greek text through English translations?

Is that your final answer?

Bernard Muller wrote:But they would sound a lot alike IN GREEK [?]

(BTW--Why not just admit that you, personally, have no idea what the answer to that question is? Huller's got you there.)

You have on the one hand Clement of Alexandria, whose knowledge of Greek would be superior to even the more erudite scholars today simply because he was an educated man speaking the language Luke and this translation of Hebrews was originally written in. Clement might not know which smart phone you...

As to whether Celsus held the opinion that Jesus "was seen indeed, but only as a shadow", and he brings against us an additional charge [προσκατηγορεῖ, from προσκατηγορέω, A. accuse besides , accuse one also of ...], as if we said [καὶ ὡς λεγόντων] that "He was seen indeed, but was o...

Part of the question is whether Celsus necessarily makes a sharp demarcation of the causes of belief in the resurrection and in the other marvelous things. The quote provided by Andrew Criddle: But after this, Celsus, having a suspicion that the great works performed by Jesus, of which we have named...

Bernard Muller wrote: does not mean they are from the same author.

Obviously.

Overall I'd guess that Celsus doesn't seem like he offered indication that he doubted what we call the 'historicity of Jesus', but it still seems hard to be sure about what Celsus genuinely believed. I'd be glad to know the secure basis for coming to any particular conclusion in that regard.

(This is not really a reply to you, Ben.) ... Doubtless, therefore, Stephan means Clement of Alexandria, concerning whom Eusebius reports as follows in History of the Church 6.14.2: Και την προς Εβραιους δε επιστολην Παυλου μεν ειναι φησιν, γεγραφθαι δε Εβραιοις Εβραικη φωνη, Λουκαν δε φιλοτιμως αυτ...

PS -- Search, seizure, and book-burning may also (unfortunately) be a factor. A ms. that lasted 100-200 years might have been found and seized, not thrown out. So it would not have made it to the trash heaps. (Manuscripts made in the second century or third century were not thrown out the next day, ...

I saw a documentary recently about an American archaeologist who's used satellite technology to scan Egypt for potential digs - she's identified over 2,500 sites. But the present politico-social situation in Egypt makes any attempts impossible :( Not necessarily. Maybe Josh McDowell and his gang ca...