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by Peter Kirby
Thu May 28, 2015 4:33 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: About a messianic prophecy from the Sibylline Oracles. . .
Replies: 55
Views: 39499

Re: About a messianic prophecy from the Sibylline Oracles. .

Fair enough. It'd be interesting to categorize those on the basis of the date of their extant texts. http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/04163.htm Book 3, Chapter 13 But it appears to me that Celsus has become acquainted with certain heresies which do not possess even the name of Jesus in common with ...
by Peter Kirby
Thu May 28, 2015 3:22 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: No pagans denied the unusual birth of Jesus?
Replies: 5
Views: 2513

Re: No pagans denied the unusual birth of Jesus?

Talk about straining out the gnat and swallowing the camel... For Origen, the fact that the canonical gospels restrained themselves to describing *only* three resurrections speaks in their favor. http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/04162.htm (Against Celsus 2.48) And that He also raised the dead, and t...
by Peter Kirby
Thu May 28, 2015 1:17 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: About a messianic prophecy from the Sibylline Oracles. . .
Replies: 55
Views: 39499

Re: About a messianic prophecy from the Sibylline Oracles. .

Most, if not all, Docetics and other Gnostics do not refer to Jesus That may be overstated. The data on 'docetics' has been presented here: http://www.earlywritings.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1305 Some data on the names used by early Christians (including some of the NHL) has been presented ...
by Peter Kirby
Thu May 28, 2015 1:12 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: John the Baptist passage authentic
Replies: 46
Views: 22154

Re: John the Baptist passage authentic

I have an interest in stylometric analysis, in my case to test my hypotheses about redaction of Pauline letters, but based on the books I have consulted (more than a few, from A. Q. Morton to Anthony Kenny to Kenneth J. Neuman and a few stray articles on analysis of the Federalist Papers, etc.), it...
by Peter Kirby
Thu May 28, 2015 12:55 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: John the Baptist passage authentic
Replies: 46
Views: 22154

Re: John the Baptist passage authentic

John or the Gospel of John is an added-on story? ?? The John in that passage = John the Baptist. Sorry, I meant "is the Gospel of John added on to the NT"? as in it has a different origin and is an arms-length story to the Synoptics. I don't completely understand. (Also, I don't understan...
by Peter Kirby
Thu May 28, 2015 12:54 pm
Forum: Academic Discussion
Topic: possible references to docetic-type beliefs
Replies: 76
Views: 42880

Re: possible references to docetic-type beliefs

Celsus (c. AD 170) focused on refuting 'docetism' (that Jesus had the 'body of a god'). http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/04161.htm Chapter 69 After this, Celsus, confusing together the Christian doctrine and the opinions of some heretical sect, and bringing them forward as charges that were applicab...
by Peter Kirby
Thu May 28, 2015 12:01 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: About a messianic prophecy from the Sibylline Oracles. . .
Replies: 55
Views: 39499

Re: About a messianic prophecy from the Sibylline Oracles. .

Here Origen very closely associates the 'title' of 'the Good' with God, speaking of "the name of God, or of the Good." Other, Hebrew names of God are also attributed to God; but in Greek, only "the Good" is attributed to God by Origen. And thus it will be found that, of the vario...
by Peter Kirby
Thu May 28, 2015 11:40 am
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: John the Baptist passage authentic
Replies: 46
Views: 22154

Re: John the Baptist passage authentic

MrMacSon wrote:John or the Gospel of John is an added-on story?
??

The John in that passage = John the Baptist.
by Peter Kirby
Wed May 27, 2015 11:50 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Ante-Nicene Pilgrimage Sites
Replies: 2
Views: 3490

Ante-Nicene Pilgrimage Sites

Origen says, around 248 CE, that a cave 'at Bethlehem' was being shown as the location of the birth of Jesus: http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/04161.htm With respect to the birth of Jesus in Bethlehem, if any one desires, after the prophecy of Micah and after the history recorded in the Gospels by t...
by Peter Kirby
Wed May 27, 2015 11:31 pm
Forum: Christian Texts and History
Topic: Messiah != Son of God
Replies: 83
Views: 33699

Messiah != Son of God

This is an interesting bit. In the earliest Christian writings (presumably Paul), 'Christ Jesus' and 'the Son of God' are equated fairly breezily.** In the third century, Origen wants to let us know that this is not something the Jews say about the Christ. http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/04161.htm ...