Why does the Talmud Place Jesus in the First Century BCE?

Discussion about the New Testament, apocrypha, gnostics, church fathers, Christian origins, historical Jesus or otherwise, etc.
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Giuseppe
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Why does the Talmud Place Jesus in the First Century BCE?

Post by Giuseppe »

Alternative tradition
The first argument is a simple one: that the Talmud had access to an alternative tradition about when Jesus lived. This is maintained by Richard Carrier in On The Historicity of Jesus, although not by any other scholar.

https://drajordan.com/2022/10/17/why-do ... dwAZ9rdD0E

I have to recognize that Richard Carrier's originality, when compared to other mythicists, is in this specific argument based on the Talmud.

In addition to the original way he deals with James, as a "brother of the Lord" but not an apostle.
schillingklaus
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Re: Why does the Talmud Place Jesus in the First Century BCE?

Post by schillingklaus »

Rene Salm of mythicistpapers fame wrote a lot about the connection of Jesus of Panthera with the Hashmonean family. There is also a connection to Alexandrine buddhism.
StephenGoranson
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Re: Why does the Talmud Place Jesus in the First Century BCE?

Post by StephenGoranson »

I don't think Jesus lived in the time of Jannaeus, but some people thought so.
One possible, though uncertain, reason might have been a confusion between Jesus and the Qumran-text-view "Teacher of Righteousness," who may indeed have lived at that time.
The "no other scholar" claim may, possibly, be iffy.
Who is more dogmatic, the current Pope or Giuseppe?
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billd89
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Re: Jesus in 1st C BC?

Post by billd89 »

Giuseppe is not afraid of the boldest claims.
Framing speculative things as absolutes, endorsing opinion as "fact" is problematic.
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Giuseppe
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Re: Why does the Talmud Place Jesus in the First Century BCE?

Post by Giuseppe »

The author of the linked article concedes that the Carrier's argument is "a simple one".

Stephen's view about a "confusion" between Jesus and the Qumranic Teacher is an example of a Misattributed Tradition (follow the link above), not of an Alternative Tradition (Carrier's view).
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John T
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Re: Why does the Talmud Place Jesus in the First Century BCE?

Post by John T »

Which Talmud?

Which Jesus?
andrewcriddle
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Re: Why does the Talmud Place Jesus in the First Century BCE?

Post by andrewcriddle »

John T wrote: Fri Oct 21, 2022 12:52 pm Which Talmud?

Which Jesus?
The Babylonian Talmud. Jesus is not mentioned in the parallel passages in the Jerusalem Talmud.
See viewtopic.php?f=3&t=9454&p=137266#p137266

Andrew Criddle
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