Marcionites baptized in the name of Christ

[mlinssen]

The key phrase you need to looks at in all Patristic writings about Marcion, among other heretics concerns the properties of the father: "Does he then assert the same Father, the Creator, as we do?"

All else derives from this property of godhood applied to the father. If this property is denied the father, and instead placed upon some archangel, then the Christ is not from the creation and the creator is not his father. And if he is not of this creation, then he cannot be the seed of any human line, since that is the creation.

This is why early Catholic creeds, when they decided to exclude Marcionites and others, added to the confession being of the seed of David. For Marcionites, being born at all via a woman, was sufficient. And it may have been an earlier more narrow creed, as others who could accept the father as creator also (either directly or passively allow angels to do so) did not all accept that Jesus had a human father, so emphasized divine seeding, and thus to a virgin (how else can she get pregnant?).

John the Baptist was removed by the Marcionite author, and it was a point of emphasis among that sect that Jesus arrived unannounced. Giuseppe's insistence that it was added by Mark is not correct, as the Marcionite gospel left many traces of the story elements elsewhere and includes the question of authority which presumes knowledge of a baptism scene starting the gospel; it's a reference to material not found in the gospel. But again it comes back to the property of the father.

The trinity element in the Patristic passage above suggests a late decades and even a century or so postmortem for the named author. We should always keep such inconsistencies in mind, just as we do reading NT text.

Marcion assigned John B the role of failed prophet, and perhaps he left the baptising of John Presbyter intact but if you do pay attention you will see that John P doesn't have John B baptise Jesus - Jesus just get baptised, and that's it

But allow me to demonstrate to you the blind bias in your thinking: bold is what I have changed from your own words

John the Baptist was introduced by the Markan author, and it was a point of emphasis among that sect that Jesus arrived unannounced.

You view everything through a Christian lens, and hence reject everything that is non-Christian - hey hey, well done Stuart. I hear there are quite a few vacancies at the Vatican these days, care to fill 'm up?

[Steven Avery]

The Anonymous Treatise on Rebaptism is very strong on baptism being in the name of (the Lord) Jesus Christ.

This is largely overlooked or bypassed by Christian scholars on water baptism.
Even Oneness writers are largely oblivious.

[mlinssen]

The Anonymous Treatise on Rebaptism is very strong on baptism being in the name of (the Lord) Jesus Christ.

This is largely overlooked or bypassed by Christian scholars on water baptism.
Even Oneness writers are largely oblivious.

GOSPELS

BOOK OF Mark
Chapter 1 The Mission of John the Baptist
4 John came [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight] in the wilderness and proclaiming a baptism of repentance for forgiveness of sins.
5 And all the region of Judea and all of Jerusalem were going out to him and were being baptized by him in the Jordan river, confessing their sins.
6 And John was clothed in camel’s hair and a belt of leather around his waist; and he is eating locusts and wild honey.
7 And he was preaching, saying, “He who comes after me is mightier than I, of whom I am not sufficient, having stooped down, to untie the strap of His sandals.
8 I baptized you with water, but He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit.” The Baptism of Jesus
9 And it came to pass in those days that Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee and was baptized in the Jordan by John.
Chapter 6 The Rejection at Nazareth
14 And King Herod heard; for His name became well known. And people were saying, “John, the one [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight], is risen out from the dead, and because of this the miraculous powers operate in him.”
24 And she having gone out, said to her mother, “What shall I ask?” And she said, “The head of John the one [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight].”
25 And having entered immediately with haste to the king, she asked, saying, “I desire that you give to me the head of John the Baptist upon a platter at once.”
Chapter 8 The Feeding of the Four Thousand
28 And they answered Him, saying, “John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; and others, one of the prophets.”
Chapter 10 Teachings about Divorce
38 And Jesus said to them, “You do not know what you ask. Are you able to drink the cup that I drink, and to be baptized with the baptism with which I am baptized?”
39 And they said to Him, “We are able.” And Jesus said to them, “You will drink the cup that I drink, and you will be baptized with the baptism with which I am baptized,
Chapter 11 The Triumphal Entry
30 The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or from men? Answer Me.”
Chapter 16 The Resurrection
16 The one having believed and having been baptized will be saved, but the one having disbelieved will be condemned.

BOOK OF Matthew
Chapter 3 The Mission of John the Baptist
1 Now in those days John the Baptist comes, preaching in the wilderness of Judea,
2 and saying, “Repent, for the kingdom of the heavens has drawn near.”
3 For this is the one having been spoken of through the prophet Isaiah, saying, “A voice of one crying in the wilderness: ‘Prepare the way of the Lord; make straight His paths.’”
4 And John himself had his garment of camel’s hair, and a leather belt around his waist, and his food was locusts and wild honey.
5 At that time were going out to him Jerusalem, and all Judea, and all the region around the Jordan,
6 and confessing their sins, were being baptized by him in the Jordan River.
7 But having seen many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, “Brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the coming wrath?
8 Therefore produce fruit worthy of repentance.
9 And do not presume to say within yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as father.’ For I say to you that out of these stones God is able to raise up children unto Abraham.
10 Already now the ax is applied to the root of the trees. Therefore every tree not producing good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but after me is coming He who is mightier than I, of whom I am not worthy to carry the sandals. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire,
12 whose winnowing fork is in His hand, and He will clear His threshing floor and will gather His wheat into the barn; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.” The Baptism of Jesus
13 Then Jesus comes from Galilee to the Jordan, unto John, to be baptized by him.
14 But John was hindering Him, saying, “I have need to be baptized by You, and do You come to me?”
15 But Jesus answering, said unto him, “Permit it presently; for thus it is fitting to us to fulfil all righteousness.” Then he permits Him.
16 And immediately, having been baptized, Jesus went up from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened and he saw the Spirit of God descending as a dove, and alighting upon Him.
Chapter 11 John’s Inquiry
11 Truly I say to you, among those born of women there has not risen one greater than John the Baptist. Yet the least in the kingdom of the heavens is greater than he!
12 And from the days of John the Baptist until now, the kingdom of the heavens is taken by violence and the violent seize it.
Chapter 14 The Beheading of John
2 and he said to his servants, “This is John the Baptist; he is risen from the dead, and because of this, the miraculous powers are working in him.”
8 And having been urged on by her mother she says, “Give me here upon a platter the head of John the Baptist.”
Chapter 16 The Demand for a Sign
14 And they said, “Some indeed, John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; and others, Jeremiah or one of the prophets.”
Chapter 17 The Transfiguration
13 Then the disciples understood that He spoke to them concerning John the Baptist.
Chapter 20 The Parable of the Workers
34 And having been moved with compassion, Jesus touched their eyes; and immediately they received sight, and they followed Him.
Chapter 21 The Triumphal Entry
25 From where was the baptism of John? From heaven, or from men?” And they were reasoning with themselves, saying, “If we should say, ‘from heaven,’ He will say to us, ‘Why then did you not believe him?’
Chapter 28 The Resurrection
19 Therefore having gone, disciple all the nations, [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight] them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit,

BOOK OF Luke
Chapter 1 Dedication to Theophilus
Chapter 3 The Mission of John the Baptist
2 during the high priesthood of Annas and Caiaphas, the word of God came upon John son of Zechariah in the wilderness.
3 And he went into all the region surrounding the Jordan, proclaiming a baptism of repentance for forgiveness of sins,
4 as it has been written in the book of the words of Isaiah the prophet: “The voice of one crying in the wilderness, ‘Prepare the way of the Lord; make His paths straight.’
5 Every valley will be filled, and every mountain and hill will be made low; and the crooked will become into straight, and the rough ways into smooth.
6 And all flesh will see the salvation of God.”
7 So he was saying to the crowds coming out to be baptized by him, “Offspring of vipers, who forewarned you to flee from the coming wrath?
8 Therefore produce fruits worthy of repentance. And do not begin to say in yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as father.’ For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones.
9 And already also the ax is applied to the root of the trees; therefore every tree not producing good fruit is cut down and is thrown into the fire.”
10 And the crowds were asking him, saying, “What then shall we do?”
11 And answering, he was saying to them, “The one having two tunics, let him impart to the one having none; and the one having food, let him do likewise.”
12 And tax collectors also came to be baptized, and they said to him, “Teacher, what shall we do?”
13 And he said to them, “Collect nothing more beyond that having been appointed to you.”
14 And those being soldiers also were asking him, saying, “And what shall we do?” And he said to them, “Extort no one, nor accuse falsely, and be content with your wages.”
15 And the people are expecting and all wondering in their hearts concerning John, whether he might be the Christ.
16 John answered all saying, “I indeed baptize you with water, but the One mightier than I comes, of whom I am not worthy to untie the strap of His sandals; He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire,
17 of whom the winnowing fork is in His hand to clear His threshing floor, and to gather the wheat into His barn. But He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.”
18 Therefore indeed exhorting many other things, he was preaching the good news to the people.
21 Now it came to pass, in all the people having been baptized, Jesus also having been baptized and having prayed, the heaven was opened,
Chapter 7 The Faith of the Centurion
20 And the men having come to Him said, “John the Baptist has sent us to you, saying, ‘Are You the coming One, or are we to look for another?’”
29 And all the people having heard, even the tax collectors, declared God righteous, having been baptized with the baptism of John.
30 But the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected the counsel of God as to themselves, not having been baptized by him.
33 For John the Baptist has come neither eating bread nor drinking wine, and you say, ‘He has a demon!’
Chapter 9 The Ministry of the Twelve
7 And Herod the Tetrarch heard of all the things being done, and was perplexed, because it was said by some that John has been raised out from the dead,
8 and by some that Elijah had appeared, and by others that a prophet of the ancients had arisen.
9 And Herod said, “John I beheaded, but who is this concerning whom I hear such things?” And he was seeking to see Him. The Feeding of the Five Thousand 19 And answering, they said, “John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; and others, that a prophet, one of the ancients, has arisen.”
Chapter 12 The Leaven of the Pharisees
50 But I have a baptism with which to be baptized, and how I am distressed until it should be accomplished!
Chapter 20 Jesus’ Authority Challenged
4 The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or from men?”

BOOK OF John
Chapter 1 The Beginning
6 There came a man having been sent from God. His name was John.
15 John witnesses concerning Him, and he cried out, saying, “This was He of whom I was saying, ‘The One coming after me has precedence over me, because He was before me.’”
16 For from His fullness, we have all received and grace upon grace.
17 For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
18 No one has ever yet seen God. The only begotten God, the One being in the bosom of the Father, He has made Him known
19 And this is the testimony of John when the Jews sent to him priests and Levites from Jerusalem, that they might ask him, “Who are you?”
20 And he confessed and did not deny, but confessed, “I am not the Christ.”
21 And they asked him, “What then? Are you Elijah?” And he says, “I am not.” “Are you the prophet?” And he answered, “No.”
22 Therefore they said to him, “Who are you, that we might give an answer to those having sent us? What do you say about yourself?”
23 He was saying, “I am a voice crying in the wilderness, ‘Make straight the way of the Lord,’” as Isaiah the prophet said.
24 And those having been sent were of the Pharisees,
25 and they asked him and said to him, “Why then do you baptize, if you are not the Christ, nor Elijah, nor the prophet?”
26 John answered them saying, “I baptize with water, but in the midst of you stands One whom you do not know,
27 the One coming after me, of whom am I not worthy that I should untie the strap of His sandal.”
28 These things took place in Bethany, across the Jordan, where John was [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight].
29 On the next day, he sees Jesus coming to him and says, “Behold the Lamb of God, the One taking away the sin of the world.
30 This is He concerning whom I said, ‘After me comes a man who has precedence over me, because He was before me.’
31 And I did not know Him. But so that He might be revealed to Israel, because of this, I came [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight] with water.”
32 And John bore witness saying, “I have beheld the Spirit descending as a dove out of heaven, and it remained upon Him.
33 And I did not know Him; but the One having sent me to baptize with water, He said to me, ‘Upon whom you shall see the Spirit descending and abiding on Him, He is the One [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight] with the Holy Spirit.’
34 And I have seen and have borne witness that this is the Sone of God.”
35 On the next day John again was standing, and two of his disciples.
36 And having looked at Jesus walking, he says, “Behold the Lamb of God!”
Chapter 3 Jesus and Nicodemus
22 After these things, Jesus and His disciples came into the land of Judea, and there He was staying with them, and was [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight].
23 Now John was also [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight] in Aenon, near Salim, because the waters were many there, and they were coming and being baptized.
27 John answered and said, “A man is able to receive not one thing if it is not given to him from heaven.
28 You yourselves bear witness to me that I said, ‘I am not the Christ, but I am sent before Him.’
29 The one having the bride is the bridegroom; and the friend of the bridegroom, the one standing and listening for him, rejoices with joy because of the bridegroom’s voice. Therefore, this joy of mine is fulfilled.
30 It behooves Him to increase, but me to decrease.
31 The One coming from above is above all. The one being from the earth is from the earth, and speaks from the earth. The One coming from heaven is above all.
32 What He has seen and heard, this He testifies, but no one receives His testimony.
33 The one having received His testimony has set his seal that God is true.
34 For He whom God sent speaks the words of God, for He gives the Spirit without measure.
35 The Father loves the Son and has given all things into His hand.
36 The one believing in the Son has eternal life, but the one not obeying the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”
Chapter 4 Jesus and the Samaritan Woman
1 Therefore when Jesus knew that Pharisees heard that Jesus makes and baptizes more disciples than John
2 (although indeed Jesus Himself was not [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight], but His disciples),
Chapter 10 Jesus the Good Shepherd
40 And He departed again beyond the Jordan, to the place where John was [highlight=2E9CCC]baptizing[/highlight] at first. And He stayed there.

ACTS

BOOK OF Acts
Chapter 1 Prologue
5 for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days after these.”
22 having begun from the baptism of John until the day in which He was taken up from us, one of these, to become a witness with us of His resurrection.”
Chapter 2 The Holy Spirit at Pentecost
38 And Peter says to them, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
41 Therefore those indeed having received his word were baptized, and on that day about three thousand souls were added.
Chapter 8 Saul Persecutes the Church
12 But when they believed Philip, proclaiming the gospel concerning the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
13 And Simon himself also believed, and having been baptized, was steadfastly continuing with Philip. And beholding the signs and great miracles being performed, he was amazed.
15 who having come down, prayed for them that they might receive the Holy Spirit.
16 For He was not yet fallen upon any of them, but they had only been baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus.
17 Then they began laying the hands upon them, and they received the Holy Spirit.
36 And as they were going along the road they came upon some water, and the eunuch says, “Behold, water! What prevents me to be baptized?”
38 And he commanded the chariot to stop. And they both went down to the water, both Philip and the eunuch, and he baptized him.
39 Now when they came up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord carried away Philip, and the eunuch saw him no longer. For he went his way rejoicing.
Chapter 9 The Road to Damascus
17 And Ananias went away and entered into the house; and having laid the hands upon him, he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus, the One having appeared to you on the road by which you were coming, has sent me that you may see again and be filled of the Holy Spirit.”
18 And immediately something like scales fell from his eyes, and he regained his sight. And having risen up, he was baptized,
Chapter 10 Cornelius Sends for Peter
37 You yourselves know the declaration having come through all Judea, having begun from Galilee, after the baptism that John proclaimed:
47 “Is anyone able to withhold the water to baptize these who have received the Holy Spirit, just as we also have?”
48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to remain some days.
Chapter 11 Peter’s Report at Jerusalem
16 And I remembered the word of the Lord, how He had said, ‘John indeed baptized with water,a but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’
Chapter 13 Paul’s First Missionary Journey
24 John having proclaimed before the face of His coming a baptism of repentance to all the people of Israel.
Chapter 16 Timothy Joins Paul and Silas
15 And when she was baptized, and her house, she begged, saying, “If you have judged me to be faithful to the Lord, having entered into my house, abide.” And she persuaded us.
33 And having taken them in that hour of the night, he washed them from the wounds, and immediately he was baptized, and all his household.
Chapter 18 Paul’s Ministry in Corinth
8 And Crispus, the ruler of the synagogue, believed in the Lord, with his all household. And many of the Corinthians hearing believed and were baptized.
25 He was instructed in the way of the Lord. And being fervent in spirit, he was speaking and was teaching earnestly the things concerning Jesus, knowing only the baptism of John.
Chapter 19 The Holy Spirit Received at Ephesus
3 And he said, “Into what then were you baptized?” And they said, “Into the baptism of John.”
4 Then Paul said, “John baptized a baptism of repentance, telling the people that they should believe in the One coming after him, that is, in Jesus.”
5 And having heard, they were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus.
6 And of Paul having laid the hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they were speaking in tongues and prophesying.
Chapter 22 Paul’s Defense to the Crowd
16 And now why do you delay? Having arisen, be baptized, and wash away your sins, calling on His name.’

EPISTLES

BOOK OF Romans
Chapter 6 Dead to Sin, Alive to God
3 Or are you unaware that as many as have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death?
4 Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, so that, just as Christ was raised up out from the dead by the glory of the Father, so we also should walk in newness of life.

BOOK OF 1 Corinthians
Chapter 1 Greetings from Paul
13 Has Christ been divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized into the name of Paul?
14 I thank God that I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius,
15 so that no one should say that you were baptized into my name.
16 Now also I baptized the household of Stephanas; as to the rest, I do not know whether I baptized any other.
17 For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel; not in wisdom of discourse, so that the cross of the Christ should not be emptied of its power.
Chapter 9 The Rights of an Apostle
Chapter 10 Warnings from Israel’s Past
2 And all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea,
Chapter 12 Spiritual Gifts
13 For also in one Spirit we all were baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink one Spirit.
Chapter 15 The Resurrection of Christ
29 Otherwise what will they do who are baptized for the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why also are they baptized for them?

BOOK OF 2 Corinthians

BOOK OF Galatians
Chapter 3 Faith and Belief
27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

BOOK OF Ephesians
Chapter 4 Unity in the Body
5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism;

BOOK OF Philippians

BOOK OF Colossians
Chapter 2 Absent in Body, Present in Spirit
12 having been buried with Him in baptism, in which also you were raised with Him through the faith of the working of God, the One having raised Him out from the dead.

BOOK OF 1 Thessalonians

BOOK OF 2 Thessalonians

BOOK OF 1 Timothy

BOOK OF 2 Timothy

BOOK OF Titus

BOOK OF Philemon

BOOK OF Hebrews
Chapter 6 A Call to Maturity
2 instruction about baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of the resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

BOOK OF James

BOOK OF 1 Peter
Chapter 3 Wives and Husbands
21 which also prefigures the baptism now saving you, not a putting away of the filth of flesh, but the demand of a good conscience toward God, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

BOOK OF 2 Peter

BOOK OF 1 John

BOOK OF 2 John

BOOK OF 3 John

BOOK OF Jude

BOOK OF Revelation

Follow the yellow rabbit, Steven Avery. What is not highlighted mostly is dialogue by John B - but do closely observe the crazy variants, the lack of consistency, and the outright experimenting going on in the NT.
I can find nothing on 'Anonymous Treatise on Rebaptism' regarding provenance, date, manuscript - but surely you will be able to enlighten me on it, or is it?

[Leucius Charinus]

It should be kept in mind that there is nothing more essential in the development of a religion than the form of its rite of initiation.

What about a "Creed"?

[Irish1975]

The Anonymous Treatise on Rebaptism is very strong on baptism being in the name of (the Lord) Jesus Christ.

This is largely overlooked or bypassed by Christian scholars on water baptism.
Even Oneness writers are largely oblivious.

Thank you, Steven! I was hoping someone would dredge up some good material on this, and this anonymous treatise does not disappoint.

This document appears to represent (according to Philip Schaff's translator) the anti-Cyprian position from that same mid-3rd century Western, African/Roman context, in which the Donatist schism was but one distinct problem alongside the broader question of re-baptizing heretics (especially Marcionites, but also Valentinians, etc.) The writer is evidently a catholic with conservative and pastoral intentions.

As you can read below, this author affirms the following:

1. Baptism in the name of Jesus is the ancient and original custom of the one church, going back to the apostles.
2. The Lord's command in Matthew 28:19 is well and good, but should not be taken as an correction and replacement of the earlier baptismal formula.
3. Baptism doesn't make a person holy or guarantee their salvation. Consider the example of Peter! The baptismal rite with water is merely the foundation for the larger work of the Holy Spirit, and any heresy should be corrected through subsequent teaching (as with the young and ignorant).
4. The position of Cyprian (i.e. now the standard Christian position) is a sudden, rebellious, unreasonable novelty after so many ages in which a non-Trinitarian baptism was both normative and thought to be sufficient.

So, if I understand this author correctly, the Cyprian faction is actually innovating an exclusively Trinitarian baptism in the mid-3rd century.

Pope Stephen took the anti-Cyprian position as well. Such a lack of unanimity in the Western Church at this time is not suprising in light of what The Refutation of All Heresies reports in Book 9 about the chaotic factionalism in Rome in the early 200s.

Here are the critical bits--

6.
...Nor, as I think, was it for any other reason that the apostles had charged those whom they addressed in the Holy Spirit, that they should be baptized in the name of Christ Jesus, except that the power of the name of Jesus invoked upon any man by baptism might afford to him who should be baptized no slight advantage for the attainment of salvation, as Peter relates in the Acts of the Apostles, saying: “For there is none other name under heaven given among men whereby we must be saved.”
As also the Apostle Paul unfolds, showing that God hath exalted our Lord Jesus, and “given Him a name, that it may be above every name, that in the name of Jesus all should bow the knee, of things heavenly and earthly, and under the earth, and every tongue should confess that Jesus is Lord in the glory of God the Father.” And he on whom, when he should be baptized, invocation should be made in the name of Jesus, although he might obtain baptism under some error, still would not be hindered from knowing the truth at some time or another, and correcting his error, and coming to the Church and to the bishop, and sincerely confessing our Jesus before men; so that then, when hands were laid upon him by the bishop, he might also receive the Holy Spirit, and he would not lose that former invocation of the name of Jesus. Which none of us may disallow, although this invocation, if it be standing bare and by itself, could not suffice for affording salvation, lest on this principle we should believe that even Gentiles and heretics, who abuse the name of Jesus, could attain unto salvation without the true and entire thing. Yet it is extremely useful to believe that this invocation of the name of Jesus, together with the correction of error and the acknowledgment of the belief of the truth, and with the putting away of all stain of past conversation, if rightly performed with the mystery of God among men of this kind, obtains a place which it would not have had, and finally, in the true faith and for the maintenance of the integrity of the sign, is no hindrance, when its supplement which had been wanting is added; and that it is consistent with good reason, with the authority of so many years, and so many churches and apostles and bishops; even as it is the very greatest disadvantage and damage to our most holy mother Church, now for the first time suddenly and without reason to rebel against former decisions after so long a series of so many ages. For not for any other reason Peter—who had already been baptized and had been asked what he thought of the Lord by the Lord Himself, and the truth of the revelation of the Father in heaven being bestowed on him had confessed that Christ was not only our Lord, but was the Son of the living God—was shown subsequently to have withstood the same Christ when He made announcement of His passion, and therefore was set forth as being called Satan. For no other reason except because it would come to pass that some, although varying in their own judgment, and somewhat halting in faith and doctrine, although they were baptized in the name of Jesus, yet, if they had been able to rescind their error in some interval of time, were not on that account cut off from salvation; but at any time that they had come to the right mind, obtained by repentance a sound hope of salvation, especially when they received the Holy Spirit, to be baptized by Whom is the duty of every man, they would have intended some such thing. Even as we do not apprehend that Peter in the Gospel suffered this alone, but all the disciples, to whom, though already baptized, the Lord afterwards says, that “all ye shall be offended in me,”[16] all of whom, as we observe, having amended their faith, were baptized after the Lord’s resurrection with the Holy Spirit. So that not without reason we also in the present day may believe that men, amended from their former error, may be baptized in the Holy Spirit, who, although they were baptized with water in the name of the Lord, might have had a faith somewhat imperfect. Because it is of great importance whether a man is not baptized at all in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, or indeed whether in some respect he halts when he is baptized with the baptism of water, which is of less account provided that afterwards a sincere faith in the truth is evident in the baptism of the Spirit, which undoubtedly is of greater account.

7. Neither must you esteem what our Lord said as being contrary to this treatment: “Go ye, teach the nations; baptize them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.”[17] Because, although this is true and right, and to be observed by all means in the Church, and moreover has been used to be observed, yet it behoves us to consider that invocation of the name of Jesus ought not to be thought futile by us on account of the veneration and power of that very name, in which name all kinds of power are accustomed to be exercised, and occasionally some even by men outside the Church. But to what effect are those words of Christ, who said that He would deny, and not know, those who should say to Him in the day of judgment, “Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Thy name, and in Thy name cast out demons, and in Thy name done many wonderful works,” when He answered them, even with emphasis,[18] “I never knew you; depart from me, ye who work iniquity,”[19] unless that it should be shown to us, that even by those who work iniquity might these good works also be done, by the superfluous[20] energy of the name of Christ? Therefore ought this invocation of the name of Jesus to be received as a certain beginning of the mystery of the Lord common to us and to all others, which may afterwards be filled up with the remaining things. Otherwise such an invocation would not avail if it should remain alone, because after the death of a man in this position there cannot be added to him anything at all, nor supplemented, nor can, in anything, avail him in the day of judgment, when they shall begin to be reproached by our Lord with those things which we have above mentioned, none of whom notwithstanding in this present time may by any man be so hardly and cruelly prohibited from aiding themselves in those ways which we have above shown.

[Irish1975]

It should be kept in mind that there is nothing more essential in the development of a religion than the form of its rite of initiation.

What about a "Creed"?

Certainly creeds became essential for Christianity after Nicea. But the typical cults of the era (Mithraism, Isis, Eleusinian mysteries, Hermetism, Sethians, etc.) had no interest in them. Nor Buddhism, Islam, most religions. The credal nature of Christianity points to--

1. Its exoteric purpose: this is a religion for the masses, and for those who seek to rule the masses.
2. There was never one Christian community, and someone had to win out by defining orthodoxy and demonizing heresy.
3. The canonical NT collection was too confusing, diverse, ambiguous. People needed to be told what it means (just as they do today).

But rites are the lifeblood of a religion. Historical catholicism is the obvious proof of this. Even before the credal battles of the 4th century and later, the bishops had to get their system in order. Baptize this way, not that. Use the sacrament to exclude Marcionites, etc.

[mlinssen]

But rites are the lifeblood of a religion. Historical catholicism is the obvious proof of this. Even before the credal battles of the 4th century and later, the bishops had to get their system in order. Baptize this way, not that. Use the sacrament to exclude Marcionites, etc.

(63) If one goes down to the water and comes up without taking anything and says “I am a Chrestian” then he has taken the name on loan. Yet if he takes the spirit which is pure, he has the gift of the name. He who has taken a gift doesn’t get her carried away from him – yet he who has taken on loan gets cut.

(72) Those who beget the name of the father, the child and the spirit which is pure don’t only beget them, but they are begotten to you. If one does not beget them, the other name will get carried away from him. Yet one takes them in the chrism of the […] of the power of the ⲥ⳨ⲟⲥ, which is what the apostles called “the right hand with the left hand” - this one Indeed is no longer a Chrestian, but an ΧΡΣ.

(101) The chreism has been made master over the baptism; for because of the chrism did they call us Christian, not because of the baptism. And the ΧΣ was called so because of the chrism, as the father indeed anointed the child, the child however anointed the apostles – and the apostles anointed us.

Interesting, Irish. Where do you get the idea that the sacrament would exclude Marcionites?

[Leucius Charinus]

It should be kept in mind that there is nothing more essential in the development of a religion than the form of its rite of initiation.

What about a "Creed"?

Certainly creeds became essential for Christianity after Nicea. But the typical cults of the era (Mithraism, Isis, Eleusinian mysteries, Hermetism, Sethians, etc.) had no interest in them. Nor Buddhism, Islam, most religions. The creedal nature of Christianity points to--

1. Its exoteric purpose: this is a religion for the masses, and for those who seek to rule the masses.
2. There was never one Christian community, and someone had to win out by defining orthodoxy and demonizing heresy.
3. The canonical NT collection was too confusing, diverse, ambiguous. People needed to be told what it means (just as they do today).

But rites are the lifeblood of a religion. Historical catholicism is the obvious proof of this. Even before the credal battles of the 4th century and later, the bishops had to get their system in order. Baptize this way, not that. Use the sacrament to exclude Marcionites, etc.

Here is a WIKI reference to Cyprian (the source in the OP) recognizing a creed (related to the apostles) as an integral part of the rite of baptism. The typical cults of the era were not based on a "Holy Writ" as was the Christian cult so it may be difficult to compare the ritual sacraments.

History
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostles%27_Creed#History

The ecclesiastical use of Latin symbolum for "creed"—in the sense of "a distinctive mark of Christians", from the sense of Greek σύμβολον, "a sign or token used for identification"—first occurs around the middle of the 3rd century, in the correspondence of St. Cyprian and St. Firmilian, the latter in particular speaking of the trinitarian formula as the "Symbol of the Trinity", and recognizing it as an integral part of the rite of baptism.[4] The term Symbolum Apostolicum appears for the first time in a letter, probably written by Ambrose, from a Council in Milan to Pope Siricius in about AD 390 "Let them give credit to the Symbol of the Apostles, which the Roman Church has always kept and preserved undefiled".[5][6] Ambrose's term is here referring to the Old Roman Creed, the immediate[7] predecessor of what is now known as the Apostles' Creed.[8][9] The narrative of this creed having been jointly created by the Apostles, with each of the twelve contributing one of twelve articles, was already current at that time.[6]

The Old Roman Creed had evolved from simpler texts based on Matthew 28:19,[6] part of the Great Commission, and it has been argued that this earlier text was already in written form by the late 2nd century (c. 180).[6][10][11]

Would you not expect that any intended exclusions / inclusions (eg: Marcionites (or any other "schisms"/sects) to be simply defined in some brief creedal statement during "baptism" or other rites? AFAIK we have no archeology for this stuff so its difficult to assess how things developed.

[Steven Avery]

As you can read below, this author affirms the following:

1. Baptism in the name of Jesus is the ancient and original custom of the one church, going back to the apostles.
2. The Lord's command in Matthew 28:19 is well and good, but should not be taken as an correction and replacement of the earlier baptismal formula.
3. Baptism doesn't make a person holy or guarantee their salvation. Consider the example of Peter! The baptismal rite with water is merely the foundation for the larger work of the Holy Spirit, and any heresy should be corrected through subsequent teaching (as with the young and ignorant).
4. The position of Cyprian (i.e. now the standard Christian position) is a sudden, rebellious, unreasonable novelty after so many ages in which a non-Trinitarian baptism was both normative and thought to be sufficient.

So, if I understand this author correctly, the Cyprian faction is actually innovating an exclusively Trinitarian baptism in the mid-3rd century.

Pope Stephen took the anti-Cyprian position as well. Such a lack of unanimity in the Western Church at this time is not suprising in light of what The Refutation of All Heresies reports in Book 9 about the chaotic factionalism in Rome in the early 200s.

Here are the critical bits--

And I similarly did some extracts and highlighting:

Apostolic Friends Forum
Treatise on Rebaptism
Sept, 2020
https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/s ... s+treatise

Especially post #4.

=============

Pure Bible Forum
ECW - baptism in Jesus name or words of Matthew 28:19 - Treatise on Rebaptism
A Treatise on Re-Baptism by an Anonymous Writer.
https://www.purebibleforum.com/index.ph ... #post-6038

=============

[Irish1975]

But rites are the lifeblood of a religion. Historical catholicism is the obvious proof of this. Even before the credal battles of the 4th century and later, the bishops had to get their system in order. Baptize this way, not that. Use the sacrament to exclude Marcionites, etc.

(63) If one goes down to the water and comes up without taking anything and says “I am a Chrestian” then he has taken the name on loan. Yet if he takes the spirit which is pure, he has the gift of the name. He who has taken a gift doesn’t get her carried away from him – yet he who has taken on loan gets cut.

(72) Those who beget the name of the father, the child and the spirit which is pure don’t only beget them, but they are begotten to you. If one does not beget them, the other name will get carried away from him. Yet one takes them in the chrism of the […] of the power of the ⲥ⳨ⲟⲥ, which is what the apostles called “the right hand with the left hand” - this one Indeed is no longer a Chrestian, but an ΧΡΣ.

(101) The chreism has been made master over the baptism; for because of the chrism did they call us Christian, not because of the baptism. And the ΧΣ was called so because of the chrism, as the father indeed anointed the child, the child however anointed the apostles – and the apostles anointed us.

Interesting, Irish. Where do you get the idea that the sacrament would exclude Marcionites?

Maybe I should have clarified that I am thinking about the emergence of catholic forms in the 3rd and 4th century.

It looks to me as though the baptismal formula was a dividing line. The 3rd century followers of Marcion went on using the formula from Acts and Paul, baptizing in the name of Jesus; while the catholic bishops developed

1. belief in the anti-Marcionite Creator/Christ God as a Trinity
2. Matthew 28:18-20
3. a standardized rite of Trinitarian baptism

By the 250s, the apostolic form of baptism was rejected in favor of a trinitarian form. This is a massive change.

The point about Matthew 28 being a late interpolation is admittedly speculative. But it rests on the very simple idea that Luke, had he “known” that the Lord commanded a Trinitarian baptism, would not have so clearly mandated a baptism in the name of Jesus instead. And the fact that 3rd century Marcionites were using the formula from Acts is a healthy reminder of how closely interwoven the catholics and Marcionites were even after the great heresiologies had been written.