I said already it made no sense to me why is the certificate said this that it should be placed on page 133 rather than page 1. I didn't understand why Tselikas would have brought forward a certificate like this as part of his case that the letter was a forgery given the fact that most of his arguments for forgery stretch the bounds of credibility. I also didn't understand how Kallistos could have written this certificate in 1976 and then modified his position so much in 1983. The bottom line is that I think human beings stink. They don't ever change their mind. They don't allow evidence to the contrary of the position they are trying to defeat all other positions. I want to distinguish myself from the majority of assholes I see walk the face of the earth by saying, "hey I think there is an error in a book which favors my position." I think my contextualization of Kallistos's position in 1976 is fair and reasonable. Those who exhibit the same asshole behavior I criticize will of course argue with my contextualization of Kallistos's position in 1976. I think they do this for reasons that have to do with winning scholarly debates rather than truthfulness. As noted the word αμφισβητούμενη which I have tentatively reconstructed as being in the certificate and means "disputed" implies that a discussion about the letter (not Secret Mark) pre-dated his writing of the certificate in 1976. His statements in 1983 seem to suggest an academic article in Nea Sion. If anyone reading this is near a library which has all the issues of Nea Sion and wants to help search for the truth, please let me know.
Quesnell writing on June 1, 1983 that Kallistos "remembers someone noting in some publication that some did report seeing this in the 16th ? 17th ? century"
Notice also that the suggestion is that there are other texts at Mar Saba which resemble the handwriting of the letter from the 18th century and that Kallistos is willing to take Quesnell there to see them. It is clear what Kallistos's opinion is. He thinks it's a disputed pseudepigraphon of Clement of Alexandria copied in the 18th century and goes back to "heretics" who occupied the monastery in an earlier period. There can be no doubt about what Kallistos believes in 1983 and what "disputed" means in 1976 (i.e. whether or not Clement actually wrote the letter) and the situation plays itself out over the course of the next three weeks.
I think this situation might explain why the letter was copied out into the "authentic" letters of Ignatius. The standard for "authenticity" or "genuineness" is held to whether or not Eusebius mentioned it.
I think there is only one publication that Kallistos likely found this reference to the Letter of Clement. Nea Sion. I only had access to titles from 1904 - 1939. Here is what I came up as possible candidates for his statement to Quesnell.
January February 1912 DIAKONOU T.P. THEMELI, Excursion to the Lavra of Saint Savva
July August 1923 ARCHIM. HIPPOLYTO Excerpts from a manuscript
Sept Oct 1923 ARCHIM. HIPPOLYTO Excerpts from a manuscript
Nov Dec 1925 ADAMANTIOU N. DIAMANTOPOULOU, Professor. Isidore the Pelusiotis
May June 1926 ADAMANTIOU N. DIAMANTOPOULOU ( PROFESSOR ), Isidoros the Pilousiotis
Sep Oct 1926 ADAMANTIOU N. DIAMANTOPOULOU (PROFESSOR), Isidoros the Pilusiotis
Nov Dec 1926 ADAMANTIOU N. DIAMANTOPOULOU ( PROFESSOR), Isidoros the Pilousiotis
January February 1931 ARCHIEP. IORDANOU T.P. FOUNDATION Various monasteries
March April 1931 ARCHIEP. IORDANOU T.P. FOUNDATION Various monasteries
May June 1931 ARCHIEP. IORDANOU T.P. FOUNDATION, Various monasteries
July August 1931 ARCHIEP. IORDANOU T.P. FOUNDATION Various monasteries
September October 1931 ARCHIEP. IORDANOU T.P. FOUNDATION Various monasteries
November December 1931 ARCHIEP. IORDANOU T.P. FOUNDATION Various monasteries
October 1933 Q. LEONTOPOLEOS SOFRONIOU, Stefanos the poet the Sabvaitis
November 1933 Q. LEONTOPOLEOS SOFRONIOU, Stefanos the poet the Sabvaitis
December 1933 Q. LEONTOPOLEOS SOFRONIOU, Stefanos the poet the Sabvaitis
February 1934 Q. LEONTOPOLEOS SOFRONIOU, Stefanos the poet the Sabvaitis
March 1934 Q. LEONTOPOLEOS SOFRONIOU, Stefanos the poet the Sabvaitis
February 1939 Q. LEONTOPOLEOS SOFRONIOU, Akakios Monk the Sabbatite
Nothing after WWII I can access. If someone is near any of these libraries please let me know:
University of California, NRLF
Richmond Field Station Bldg. 400, Meade and South 47th St., Richmond, CA, 94804-4698, United States
UC Berkeley Libraries
133 Doe Library, University of California, Berkeley, CA, 94720-6000, United States
Graduate Theological Union
2400 Ridge Rd., Berkeley, CA, 94709-1212, United States
Concordia College Library
Carl B. Ylvisaker Library
901 8th Street South, Moorhead, MN, 56562, United States
Dallas Theological Seminary
Turpin Library
3909 Swiss Avenue, Dallas, TX, 75204-6411, United States
Center for Research Libraries
Center for Research Libraries – Collections
6050 S Kenwood Ave, Chicago, IL, 60637, United States
University of Notre Dame
Hesburgh Library
150 Hesburgh Library, Notre Dame, IN, 46556-5629, United States
Concordia Theological Seminary
Wayne and Barbara Kroemer Library
6600 North Clinton Street, Fort Wayne, IN, 46825-4996, United States
HathiTrust Digital Library
1001 North Buhr Building, 200 Hill Street, Ann Arbor, MI, 48104, United States
University of Cincinnati - Main Campus
Langsam Library
2911 Woodside Drive, Cincinnati, OH, 45221-0033, United States
Pennsylvania State University Libraries
127 Paterno Library, University Park, PA, 16802-1808, United States
Virginia Tech
Newman Library
560 Drillfield Drive, Blacksburg, VA, 24061, United States
Dumbarton Oaks Research Library
1703 32nd St NW, Washington, DC, 20007-2691, United States
Library of Congress
101 Independence Avenue, SE, Washington, DC, 20540, United States
Harvard University
Harvard University, Cambridge, MA, 02138, United States
Hellenic College, Holy Cross Greek Orthodox
Archbishop Iakovos Library and Learning Resource Center
50 Goddard Avenue, Brookline, MA, 02445-7496, United States
Hawaii Pacific University
Learning Commons, HPU
1 Aloha Tower Dr, Honolulu, HI, 96813, United States
The British Library, St. Pancras
96 Euston Road, London, NW1 2DB, United Kingdom
King's College London
Subscriptions & Access, Room G.35, King's College London, Maughan Library, London, WC2A 1LR, United Kingdom
I just phoned George Dragas and left a message to see if he remembers what journal article Kallistos was speaking about in 1983 where he saw the document referenced. Dragas was in the room listening to the conversation between Kallistos and Quesnell. I am going to email him the notes from Quesnell. Maybe it jogs his memory. I also sent him Quesnell's notes from that date as well as the BAR file containing the photos of the book and the letter from 1976. Hail Mary.
