"Immar-Yah" => " 'Immr-ya" => "Marya"

Discussion about the New Testament, apocrypha, gnostics, church fathers, Christian origins, historical Jesus or otherwise, etc.
lsayre
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Re: "Immar-Yah" => " 'Immr-ya" => "Marya"

Post by lsayre »

What is the 'human' name of your proposed 'Jesus'?
Charles Wilson
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Re: "Immar-Yah" => " 'Immr-ya" => "Marya"

Post by Charles Wilson »

lsayre wrote: Tue Dec 07, 2021 7:16 amWhat is the 'human' name of your proposed 'Jesus'?
Wow, that's the Big Question. It was a purpose of this Thread to propose that the Priest - remembering that one idea of John was to Correct the Synoptics - was actually named as a variant of "Immar-Yah". "Behold [the] Lamb of God".

He was of "Immer" - "Lamb". Real or Coincidence?
Of interest is the Aramaicist View that in the Peshitta, there are many, many references to "Marya" but the actual "Lamb-of-God" statements in John are Unmodified! Would a Roman Court Member, writing on Orders from You-Know-Who, have had knowledge of "Immar-Yah"?

Knowledge of "Nimrod" had already been lost. Nicodemus doesn't understand the Idiom "Return-to-Mother".
"Behold the Lamb-of-God!" Matthew suggests that there is a Real "Realm-of-Heaven", a Pointer to the Operations of the Priesthood that has survived as a Criticism of the Scribes and Pharisees.

"Lamb-of-God" should be a Name in a Form that is not recognizable as "Marya" in the Linguistic History of the Term.
I'm willing to go along with this as a Name. The Priest is running the Show for the Coup that will Overthrow the Romans and Herodians.
This might point to "Lamb-of-God" as being a Title. HOWEVER, the Priestly Apparatus is more recent than is apparent.
Hasmonean History again.

Mark 5: 22 - 24 (RSV):

[22] Then came one of the rulers of the synagogue, Ja'irus by name; and seeing him, he fell at his feet,
[23] and besought him, saying, "My little daughter is at the point of death. Come and lay your hands on her, so that she may be made well, and live."
[24] And he went with him.

If John wrote this in Mark, there would be a moment, "Behold the Lamb-of-God! And he fell at his feet..."
There is no such moment here. Mark obliterates the Name of the Priest. The Revision of Symbolism is more important.

By Coincidence or other Device, "Lamb-of-God" appears to be a Name but it is by no means a certain thing.

Thanx again lsayre for your help and contributions.

CW
Charles Wilson
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Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:13 am

Re: "Immar----El"?

Post by Charles Wilson »

There is another possibility for the "Animal Name Paired with the God Name".
The "--iel" ending for Canaanite "El".

"Daniel", "Nathaniel" and so on.

This ending would give "Immar-El" , which would eventually give "Mariel" and derivatives.
This more direct variant is now a more often used Feminine name in today's world.

I have no knowledge of possible usage back then.

It's not as easy as "Elijah", which just about covers all the bases.
Just a thought.

CW
lsayre
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Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2015 3:39 pm

Re: "Immar-Yah" => " 'Immr-ya" => "Marya"

Post by lsayre »

"Immar-El" is starting to come somewhat close to Emmanuel. Might that have been Jesus name while he was alive?
Charles Wilson
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Re: "Immar-Yah" => " 'Immr-i-El? => "Immanuel"?

Post by Charles Wilson »

lsayre --

I'm starting work on that one.

The one reference to Immanuel/Emmanuel in the NT is in Matthew, Chapter 1.
Matthew 1 is, as I say from time to time, radioactive.

I have the genealogy as coming from - that name again - Nicholas of Damascus:

Josephus, Ant..., 14, 1, 3:

"But there was a certain friend of Hyrcanus, an Idumean, called Antipater, who was very rich, and in his nature an active and a seditious man; who was at enmity with Aristobulus, and had differences with him on account of his good-will to Hyrcanus. It is true that Nicolatls [sic] of Damascus says, that Antipater was of the stock of the principal Jews who came out of Babylon into Judea; but that assertion of his was to gratify Herod, who was his son, and who, by certain revolutions of fortune, came afterward to be king of the Jews, whose history we shall give you in its proper place hereafter..."

Matthew 1: 12, then 23 and 20 - 21: (RSV):

[12] And after the deportation to Babylon: Jechoni'ah was the father of She-al'ti-el, and She-al'ti-el the father of Zerub'babel

We then get to the quote for Emmanuel:

[23] "Behold, a virgin shall conceive and bear a son,
and his name shall be called Emmanuel"
(which means, God with us).

However, what do we find above this verse?

[20] But as he considered this, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, "Joseph, son of David, do not fear to take Mary your wife, for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit;
[21] she will bear a son, and you shall call his name Jesus, for he will save his people from their sins."

That Damned (Literally) Domitian again, dba "The Holy Spirit". Always fathering Demi-Gods and stuff.

SO WHICH IS IT? "Jesus" or "Immanuel/Emmanuel"? Why is it important to invent genealogies and change names and have births in mangers so that a Bogus Census can take place that doesn't find the Son of God?

"Immanuel" does have much to recommend it here. In support of the idea, for example, Jay Raskin has the word "Jews" being changed (Plausibly) into "Christians" as "...that strange religion" in Eusebius, if memory serves (and Memory may have taken the day off in some of the details...). Change words, change History, it's all for the Cause. "Immar-i-el" => "Imman-u-el" to align with the OT.

There is some work to do but I find a lot to recommend your suggestion. I believe that something like this happened.
I may be totally wrong with all of this but I don't think so. Knowledge of Judaic Language and Culture was used in the CONSTRUCTION of the NT.

The "Pairing of an Animal Name with a God Name" is Semitic and goes back thousands of years to Sumer if Pettinato is to be believed.
The Question of Authorship for the NT in the Roman Colleges then becomes Paramount:

What did they know?
Who, from the Judaic Survivors, helped them?
What did they change?

"...and his name shall be called Emmanuel"

Thank you, lsayre.

CW
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