Are there hints of a Gnostic Jesus within the Canonical NT?

[lsayre]

To get this rolling, I find "Let the dead bury their dead" to be rather Gnostic.

[davidmartin]

"The Spirit gives life the flesh counts for nothing" has a nice wholesome gnostic ring to it
"You have the words of eternal life" (Ahem, isn't it supposed to be the cross that saves? Jesus get with the program or no council of Nicea for you!)

[schillingklaus]

The NT is full of hints, as the saviour is a gnostic invention which has been Judaized as a messiah by Christianity, at the expense of redactorial fatigue.

[Gnostic Bishop]

"The Spirit gives life the flesh counts for nothing" has a nice wholesome gnostic ring to it
"You have the words of eternal life" (Ahem, isn't it supposed to be the cross that saves? Jesus get with the program or no council of Nicea for you!)

Gnostic Christians venerate our flesh.

It is what houses God and should be venerated.

Gnostic Jesus and I see heaven here and now and all in heaven is worthy of veneration.

Let me speak to the lie of Gnostic Christians hating matter.

I wrote this to refute the false notion that Gnostic Christians do not like matter and reality that the inquisitors propagated to justify their many murders of my religion’s originators. It shows that Christians should actually hate matter and not Gnostic Christians.

The Christian reality.
1 John 2:15Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 16For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

Gen 3; 17 Thou shalt not eat of it; cursed is the ground for thy sake; in toil shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life.
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The Gnostic Christian reality.
Gnostic Christian Jesus said, "Those who seek should not stop seeking until they find. When they find, they will be disturbed. When they are disturbed, they will marvel, and will reign over all.
[And after they have reigned they will rest.]"

"If those who attract you say, 'See, the Kingdom is in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you.

If they say to you, 'It is under the earth,' then the fish of the sea will precede you.

Rather, the Kingdom of God is inside of you, and it is outside of you.

[Those who] become acquainted with [themselves] will find it; [and when you] become acquainted with yourselves, [you will understand that] it is you who are the sons of the living Father.

But if you will not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are that poverty."

As you can see from that quote, if we see God's kingdom all around us and inside of us, we cannot think that the world is anything but evolving perfection. Most just don't see it and live in poverty. Let me try to make you see the world the way I do.

Here is a mind exercise. Tell me what you see when you look around. The best that can possibly be, given our past history, or an ugly and imperfect world?

Candide.
"It is demonstrable that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as all things have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for the best end.”

That means that we live in the best of all possible worlds, because it is the only possible world, given all the conditions at hand and the history that got us here. That is an irrefutable statement given entropy and the anthropic principle.

Regards
DL

[Secret Alias]

I truly believe the way we use "gnostic" wasn't the way ancients used the term.

[Gnostic Bishop]

The NT is full of hints, as the saviour is a gnostic invention which has been Judaized as a messiah by Christianity, at the expense of redactorial fatigue.

I guess that you were not aware of the following when saying Gnostic Christians invented a savior.

I also guess that you were not aware of the following, as well as the fact that Gnostic Christians hold no supernatural beliefs.

We do not think much of those who believe in imaginary supernatural fantasies and realms.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrDGgKunPsY

Regards
DL

[Gnostic Bishop]

Do these quotes used by Gnostic Christians qualify for or to the O.P.?


Modern Gnostic Christians name our god "I am", and yes, we do mean ourselves.

You are your controller. I am mine. You represent and present whatever mind picture you have of your God or ideal human, and so do I.

The name "I Am" you might see as meaning something like, --- I think I have grown up thanks to having forced my apotheosis through Gnosis and meditation and “I am”, represents the best rules and laws that we have found to live by.

In Gnostic Christianity, we follow the Christian tradition that Christians have forgotten that they are to do. That is, become brethren to Jesus.

That is why some say that the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

Here is the real way to salvation that Jesus taught.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Allan Watts explain those quotes in detail.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw

Joseph Campbell shows the same esoteric ecumenist idea in this link.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGx4IlppSgU

The bible just plainly says to put away the things of children. The supernatural and literal reading of myths.

Gnosis enlightens adults.

Regards
DL

[davidmartin]

The very idea that Jesus had his own teachings that leads to life goes against the Pauline idea of salvation through faith
So these 'words of life' are curious and do have a gnostic or perhaps better to say 'mystical' quality
Just having a body/matter duality as DL says probably isnt the best place to look

[Gnostic Bishop]

The very idea that Jesus had his own teachings that leads to life goes against the Pauline idea of salvation through faith
So these 'words of life' are curious and do have a gnostic or perhaps better to say 'mystical' quality
Just having a body/matter duality as DL says probably isnt the best place to look

Salvation?????

Who condemned God's most fantastic entity, humanity?

We all have some kind of ideology and to suggest that Jesus did not have one is not accurate or logical.

What does what Jesus taught do to your notion s on substitutional punishment?

Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Deuteronomy 24:16 (ESV) "Fathers shall not be put to death because of their children, nor shall children be put to death because of their fathers. Each one shall be put to death for his own sin.

Who is Jesus saying will die for your sins, if not you?

Can Jesus morally and ethically die for you?

Regards
DL

[davidmartin]

DL My thesis is the original Christians didn't believe in a substitutional punishment and someone else came up with that idea
Why does salvation have to be taking something away (sin) and not giving something that wasn't previously had?
The woman at the well episode in John is the earlier understanding of salvation being in the form of a gift. He didn't give her substitutional punishment at the well but a new husband, it says that in the footnotes, so how can substitutional punishment be the original salvation?