Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Discussion about the Hebrew Bible, Septuagint, pseudepigrapha, Philo, Josephus, Talmud, Dead Sea Scrolls, archaeology, etc.
The Crow
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Re: Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Post by The Crow »

stephan happy huller wrote:No one could possibly be this passionate about this nonsense save for the author and her lap dog.
Stephen you should have said "dogs" as in plural.
outhouse
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Re: Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Post by outhouse »

Mental flatliner wrote: You should have read the Old Testament (which was my source). The Old Testament is, in and of itself, a legitimate historical source,
On what planet? :tombstone: Your view has been long dead.


Moses has no historicity at all, that is a fact.


It is also factual that Israelites formed from displaces Canaanites who settled the highlands of Israel after 1200 BC.

It took a few hundred years for them to even begin to have any identity different from that of the Canaanites.

At roughly 1000BC they still had

Canaanite deities
Canaanite alphabet
Canaanite pottery


These are facts you will have to deal with.
outhouse
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Re: Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Post by outhouse »

Mental flatliner wrote:
In addition, there are too many events in the Old Testament that have been confirmed
And many are claimed to be mythical in nature, and or literary creations after monotheistic redactions.



It would be great if you came in here with something besides biblical ignorance to debate with.
ficino
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Re: Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Post by ficino »

mentalflatliner is gone.
Adam
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Re: Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Post by Adam »

Thanks, Ipetrich,
I find both your posts illuminating. The first agrees with what I worked out as well.
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lpetrich
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Re: Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Post by lpetrich »

Timeline:
  • 1800 - 1720: Canaanites arrive in northern Egypt
  • 1650: Hyksos take over
  • (date uncertain) 1630 - 1600: Thera caldera eruption
  • 1550: Hyksos expelled by Ahmose (Akh Moshe, "Brother of Moses"?)
  • around 1500: Amenhotep I or Thutmose I start the New Kingdom's Levantine Empire, which extended all the way to the Euphrates and Anatolia
  • around 1200: The Sea Peoples devastate much of the eastern Meditarranean, destroying the Mycenaean, Hittite, and Mitanni kingdoms
  • 1208: Merneptah's Victor Stele, the first known reference to "Israel"
  • 1175: Ramesses III fights the Sea Peoples in Egypt and the Levant
  • around 1100: the Onomasticon of Amenope hints that some of the Sea Peoples had settled in Canaan
  • 1107 - 1077: Ramesses XI ruled rather weakly, with Egypt losing Nubia and half-splitting into Upper Egypt and Lower Egypt
  • around 840: the Moabite Stone / Mesha Stele, which describes how King Omri of Israel and his son had conquered Moab but were beaten back
  • 841: Assyrian king Shalmaneser III forces King Jehu, "Son of Omri", to pay tribute
  • around 825: The Tel Dan stele, which refers to the "House of David"
  • 622: During King Josiah's reign, high priest Hilkiah "discovered" the "Book of the Law" in the Jerusalem Temple, likely an early version of Deuteronomy. The oldest reference to Moses in the Bible?
  • 597 - 539: Babylonian Exile. Did much of the Moses story take shape during it or shortly after it?
So it was nearly a thousand years between the expulsion of the Hyksos and the story of Moses taking its familiar form.
lecteur reader
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Re: Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Post by lecteur reader »

mo-she > she-mo
In hebrew : "shemo" mean "his name"

"aaron" come from "ha aron"
In hebrew > ha aron is "the ark"
Robert Tulip
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Re: Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Post by Robert Tulip »

My Book Review of Did Moses Exist? is at http://www.amazon.com/review/R2PFCVC4RIFMSL
Robert Tulip
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Re: Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Post by Robert Tulip »

Some comments on my review
Jon Smetana says:
Everyone, on occasion, is doubtful about something. But few people transform their doubtfulness into a five hundred page masterpiece. D.M. Murdock was doubtful about the story of Moses. Her "Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver" is excellent. And so is Robert Tulip's review of it. The orderly, numbered, miniature textbook style of Tulip's review is greatly appreciated.

Zen Osho says:
Dear Robert,
Greetings!
Trust me, your aforesaid review on this excellent book by D. M. Murdock was truly a comprehensive one indeed. I have read many a review herein before procuring a book from Amazon, but I must say, I have yet to encounter such a rendering as yours. Just as what Jon has mentioned, the systematic approach is greatly appreciated, and I should think would be welcomed by others. Kudos to you, Robert!
Cheers & Regards!
Arvind
http://freethoughtblogs.com/carrier/archives/294
“Moses was based on Dionysus” is right up there with “Jesus came from a flying saucer.”
...
In your entire analysis you fail to cite a single ancient source describing anything about Dionysus that relevantly parallels the story of Moses. How do you not notice this fatal flaw? You are missing the key premise in the whole argument. If you can’t even figure out how logic works, what’s the point? Richard Carrier
The Crow
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Re: Did Moses Exist? The Myth of the Israelite Lawgiver

Post by The Crow »

I always find it odd that no one ever mentions books 6 and 7......who wrote those? Moses supposedly? They began to appear in the 18th or 19th Century.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sixth_and_ ... s_of_Moses

What about the Jewish Historian Artapanus? He is named by Eusebius
in his Evangelicae Preparationis and his
detailed account of the life of Moses
is reported in his Pamphilis, Book 9, Ch. 27, 1-37.

http://www.lexiline.com/lexiline/lexi300.htm
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