Galatians 1:21-24 : churches of Judea

[rgprice]

So what exactly is the etymology of "church"? Is this a Latinism? At what point was this translation introduced?

[Jax]

I think that it is English. Like lord.

[cora]

Of course no reaction, the subject is taboo. If Paul was so in line with roman Christianity why were his letters then forged beyond recognition? Paul speaks Aramaic, so maybe he was raised in a Hellenistic jewish family. But he has left all that behind long time ago. These things happen, also today. Quoting from forgeries in Paul can keep you busy for years. That was the exact meaning of it. Just like the Acts are fake, and the pastorals, you better watch out before quoting from Paul. Better be sure that it IS Paul. Trying to prove something from Paul is a hazardous undertaking. Anycase Marcion brought Paul's 10 letters and the gospel of the Lord to Rome. (who again is saying "the Lord"). He said it all came from Paul, and he was telling the truth. When you go further into the matter, you will find that the church immediately saw that it was all gnostic. Of course back then they knew what they were speaking about, what cannot be said about these last centuries.
The word assembly is wrong, I read always community. The communities in Judea were not Christian, they were jewish. Christians would be murdered out immediately. Paul never persecuted anybody, he was living in Turkey. Again a forgery, in line with the Acts which are fake. And he also was never called Saul. Saul was taken from Josephus. And Paulos means small, it was a nickname, because he was very short.
I don't mind people using their imagination, but the whole story about the godfearer's assembly's and Paul is totally bogus. Totally. Paul went to the utmost west of Turkey and founded there new communities. Gnostic communities. It is where the gnostic gospel of John comes from. It is these communities that Irenaeus describes and judges in book 1 of his large book. He does not tell WHERE they are. But Tim Holland does: on his website you will find a map. They are all in the utmost west of Turkey, they are all founded by Paul. About fifteen of them. That is what he was doing before in the end he went to Greece. By the way, Paul had red hair, a very fair skin and blue eyes. That does not sound jewish to me at all.
And please stop that childish behaviour when the word "gnostic" appears. There is nothing wrong with gnostics. And it appeared 100 years before roman Christianity. They are some kind of heresy of gnostic chrestianity, and not the other way around. That is only when you believe their fairy-tale about themselves, which they could spread as soon as they had won. Seemingly everybody still believes that fairy-tale, including here on the forum.

[rgprice]

I think the issue may be this: Church seems to be a more appropriate translation for the Greek term kyriakon doma, which means house of the Lord. But this term isn't used in the NT. Instead, ekklēsia is used, which is more appropriately an assembly. But really, kyriakon doma was also used by non-Christians.

The issue is that "church" is a specific Christian word that has loaded connotation. What Paul and others in the NT texts were dealing with were not "Christian churches", they were assemblies of worshipers of the Highest God, which existed long before Paul or any talk of Jesus came on the scene.

[Ben C. Smith]

So what exactly is the etymology of "church"? Is this a Latinism? At what point was this translation introduced?

The following etymology is correct:

I think the issue may be this: Church seems to be a more appropriate translation for the Greek term kyriakon doma, which means house of the Lord.

"Church" and its cognate "kirk" are ultimately derived from the Greek for "lordly."

[cora]

Who is the Highest God? Is that Jahweh the Lord, or the gnostic god? Would be nice to know. In fact Paul founded new communities, which were gnostic, in the very west of Turkey, before he went to Greece. About 15 new communities.
I don't know what assemblies of worshippers of the highest god are, but I am sure they have nothing to do with Paul.

Church is not a translation, it is a word that slowly developed, as the language developed. In fact it derives from the greek oikia kyriake, which indeed means house of the Lord. Of course this is not used in the NT, because this Lord is Jahweh. And of course everybody used it, because it was the name of the church of rome. Who like I said before were Jahweh worshippers with the Septuagint as scripture. Easy to see at the visit of Marcion. Only the Septuagint, not 1 page of Christian papers. In fact everything what Marcion was showing was completely new to them. This means the church of rome was not Christian when Marcion appeared.
I never read differently than that an ekklesia is translated with community, in Judea as well as in Turkey and Greece. If you don't mind I would like to stick to that.

[cora]

Wrong. Church comes from Kyriake what means "of the Lord", the Lord being Jahweh. Oikia Kyriake being the name of the church of Rome.
Don't forget Kirk, Kerk and Kirche (Scandinavian, dutch and german).

[rgprice]

So what exactly is the etymology of "church"? Is this a Latinism? At what point was this translation introduced?

The following etymology is correct:

I think the issue may be this: Church seems to be a more appropriate translation for the Greek term kyriakon doma, which means house of the Lord.

"Church" and its cognate "kirk" are ultimately derived from the Greek for "lordly."

I guess the question is, what is the history of the translation of ekklēsia? At what point was it translated as something other than simply an assembly? Did it happen in Latin, or was it later?

[Ben C. Smith]

I guess the question is, what is the history of the translation of ekklēsia? At what point was it translated as something other than simply an assembly? Did it happen in Latin, or was it later?

The Latin Vulgate has ecclesia, taken directly from the Greek, so that is not it. I am no expert on English Bibles, but I imagine "church" came into play with them. Tyndale has congregacion. Wycliffe, Geneva, and the KJV have church.

[Jax]

I would guess that it was when the King James version was created. But that's just a guess.