Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

Discussion about the New Testament, apocrypha, gnostics, church fathers, Christian origins, historical Jesus or otherwise, etc.
Secret Alias
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Re: Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

Post by Secret Alias »

I contacted my Samaritan friend when I struggled to find a solution to the meaning of Bereshith. It's like being transported back in time. The Samaritans have kabbalah but they still deny it when you ask them specific questions. In this case he is in Seattle and I am out of the country. His initial text back to me was "the counting of the letters of the A-B is meaningless and not scientific. It is only a mind game, not serious.בראשית=913" But later in the day when I said Eshim his response was an affirmed "Fine. Correct." This is how it always is, was and always will be.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Re: Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

Post by Secret Alias »

So the thing become clear that all the different "heretics" were saying basically the same things albeit in slightly different ways. So the arche of Marcus and the Valentinians was basically the same idea as "the angels" who created the world in Simon Magus. The rule of truth becomes a reworking of the heretical "arche" concept albeit now from a strictly monarchIan perspective. Look at chapter 22:
The rule of truth which we hold, is, that there is one God Almighty, who made all things by His Word, and fashioned and formed, out of that which had no existence, all things which exist. Thus saith the Scripture, to that effect "By the Word of the Lord were the heavens established, and all the might of them, by the spirit of His mouth." And again, "All things were made by Him, and without Him was nothing made." There is no exception or deduction stated; but the Father made all things by Him, whether visible or invisible, objects of sense or of intelligence, temporal, on account of a certain character given them, or eternal; and these eternal things He did not make by angels, or by any powers separated from His Ennoea
The true beginning now is a singular ruling power who curiously sent his Son (!) to redeem the world - already the derivative nature or reactionary nature of orthodoxy is evident. The original understanding was clearly that the powers were a secret held by the priestly elite.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Re: Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

Post by Secret Alias »

Some context for the eshim (spelled with yod which only represents a less archaic spelling).

https://gnosticteachings.org/glossary/i/2469-ishim.html

Later kabbalah and Maimonides ranks the e(i)shim as the lowest ranked angels (sublunar realm realm). Originally clearly THE angels.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Re: Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

Post by Secret Alias »

The odd thing now is that as I try and trace the idea of בראשית/ἀρχή in the Torah I see an obvious connection with Iranian religion.
Amesha spenta, ( Avestan: “beneficent immortal”) Pahlavi amshaspend, in Zoroastrianism, any of the six divine beings or archangels created by Ahura Mazdā, the Wise Lord, to help govern creation. Three are male, three female. Ministers of his power against the evil spirit, Ahriman, they are depicted clustered about Ahura Mazdā on golden thrones attended by angels. They are the everlasting bestowers of good. They are worshipped separately and are said to descend to service on paths of light. Each has a special month, festival, and flower and presides over an element in the world order. In later Zoroastrianism each is opposed by a specific archfiend.

Of the six, Asha Vahishta and Vohu Manah are by far the most important. Asha Vahishta (Avestan: Excellent Order, or Truth) is the lawful order of the cosmos according to which all things happen. He presides over fire, sacred to the Zoroastrians as the inner nature of reality. To the devotee he holds out the path of justice and spiritual knowledge. Vohu Manah (Avestan: Good Mind) is the spirit of divine wisdom, illumination, and love. He guided Zoroaster’s soul before the throne of heaven. He welcomes the souls of the blessed in paradise. Believers are enjoined to “bring down Vohu Manah in your lives on Earth” through profound love in marriage and toward one’s fellowman. He presides over domestic animals. Khshathra Vairya (Desirable Dominion), who presides over metal, is the power of Ahura Mazdā’s kingdom. The believer can realize this power in action guided by Excellent Order and Good Mind. Spenta Armaiti (Beneficent Devotion), the spirit of devotion and faith, guides and protects the believer. She presides over Earth. Haurvatāt (Wholeness or Perfection) and Ameretāt (Immortality) are often mentioned together as sisters. They preside over water and plants and may come to the believer as a reward for participation in the natures of the other amesha spentas.
The menorah is the obvious confirmation of the Iranian origins of the Israelite religion of the Pentateuch

Image

I wonder where the monotheistic interest in Judaism originates.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Charles Wilson
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Re: Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

Post by Charles Wilson »

Secret Alias wrote:I wonder where the monotheistic interest in Judaism originates.
Before the Exile: Lotsa' house gods, the Caananite Pantheon.
After the Exile: Monotheism. Fertility Problems? Pray to El and him alone. Asherah had already been turned into a totem, and is now "vanished". Only God is in the Garden of Eden.

CW
Secret Alias
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Re: Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

Post by Secret Alias »

Genesis Rabbah makes it explicit
It is forbidden to inquire what existed before creation, as Moses distinctly tells us (Deut. 4. 32): 'Ask now of the days that are past which were before thee, since the day God created man upon earth.' Thus the scope of inquiry is limited to the time since the Creation.--Gen. Rabba 1
But thenough the clues are already there. Bereshith can be read as two words bara shith "created six" and later:
Six things preceded the creation of the world. Some were actually created, and others came up only in God's thought as what was to be created. Torah and the throne of glory were created.The creation of the fathers, Israel, the Temple, and the name of the Messiah came up only in God's thought.
The idea of the "arche/bereshith" (= rule) creating the Torah helps explain I think Irenaeus's identification of the "rule of truth" being related to but not exactly identical with "the Scriptures."

The fact that "Torah" was originally identified with "the Ten" (utterances) also assisting in understanding Gnostic thought. Interestingly one of the earliest gospel names was "according to the Twelve." https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gospel_of_the_Twelve
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Re: Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

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Philo's understanding of the ten commandments assumes the eshim as intermediaries (thus serving as the basis for arche/bereshith as the basis to scriptures generally:
This, then, may be enough to say on these subjects; but it is necessary now to connect with these things what I am about to say, namely, that it was the Father of the universe who delivered these ten maxims, or oracles, or laws and enactments, as they truly are, to the whole assembled nation of men and women altogether. Did he then do so, uttering himself some kind of voice? Away! let not such an idea ever enter your mind; for God is not like a man, in need of a mouth, and of a tongue, and of a windpipe, but as it seems to me, he at that time wrought a most conspicuous and evidently holy miracle, commanding an invisible sound to be created in the air, more marvellous than all the instruments that ever existed, attuned to perfect harmonies; and that not an inanimate one, nor yet, on the other hand, one that at all resembled any nature composed of soul and body; but rather it was a rational soul filled with clearness and distinctness, which fashioned the air and stretched it out and changed it into a kind of flaming fire, and so sounded forth so loud and articulate a voice like a breath passing through a trumpet, so that those who were at a great distance appeared to hear equally with those who were nearest to it. For the voices of men, when they are spread over a very long distance, do naturally become weaker and weaker, so that those who are at a distance from them cannot arrive at a clear comprehension of them, but their understanding is gradually dimmed by the extension of the sound over a larger space, since the organs also by which it is extended are perishable. (35) But the power of God, breathing forth vigorously, aroused and excited a new kind of miraculous voice, and diffusing its sound in every direction, made the end more conspicuous at a distance than the beginning, implanting in the soul of each individual another hearing much superior to that which exists through the medium of the ears. For the one, being in some degree a slower kind of external sense, remains in a state of inactivity until it is struck by the air, and so put in motion. But the sense of the inspired mind outstrips that, going forth with the most rapid motion to meet what is said. This, then, may be enough to say about the divine voice
And again:
And a voice sounded forth from out of the midst of the fire which had flowed from heaven, a most marvellous and awful voice, the flame being endowed with articulate speech in a language familiar to the hearers, which expressed its words with such clearness and distinctness that the people seemed rather to be seeing than hearing it. (47) And the law testifies to the accuracy of my statement, where it is written, "And all the people beheld the voice most evidently." For the truth is that the voice of men is calculated to be heard; but that of God to be really and truly seen. Why is this? Because all that God says are not words, but actions which the eyes determine on before the ears. (48) It is, therefore, with great beauty, and also with a proper sense of what is consistent with the dignity of God, that the voice is said to have come forth out of the fire; for the oracles of God are accurately understood and tested like gold by the fire. (49) And God also intimates to us something of this kind by a figure. Since the property of fire is partly to give light, and partly to burn, those who think fit to show themselves obedient to the sacred commands shall live for ever and ever as in a light which is never darkened, having his laws themselves as stars giving light in their soul. But all those who are stubborn and disobedient are for ever inflamed, and burnt, and consumed by their internal appetites, which, like flame, will destroy all the life of those who possess them.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Re: Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

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More clues on how the Marcosians grounded their tetrad in the account from Genesis:
And while they affirm such things as these concerning the creation, every one of them generates something new, day by day, according to his ability; for no one is deemed "perfect," who does not develop among them some mighty fictions. It is thus necessary, first, to indicate what things they metamorphose [to their own use] out of the prophetical writings, and next, to refute them. Moses, then, they declare, by his mode of beginning the account of the creation, has at the commencement pointed out the mother of all things when he says, "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth;"(1) for, as they maintain, by naming these four,--God, beginning, heaven, and earth,--he set forth their Tetrad. Indicating also its invisible and hidden nature, he said, "Now the earth was invisible and unformed."(2) They will have it, moreover, that he spoke of the second Tetrad, the offspring of the first, in this way--by naming an abyss and darkness, in which were also water, and the Spirit moving upon the water. Then, proceeding to mention the Decad, he names light, day, night, the firmament, the evening, the morning, dry land, sea, plants, and, in the tenth place, trees. Thus, by means of these ten names, he indicated the ten AEons. The power of the Duodecad, again, was shadowed forth by him thus:--He names the sun, moon, stars, seasons, years, whales, fishes, reptiles, birds, quadrupeds, wild beasts, and after all these, in the twelfth place, man. Thus they teach that the Triacontad was spoken of through Moses by the Spirit. Moreover, man also, being formed after the image of the power above, had in himself that ability which flows from the one source. This ability was seated in the region of the brain, from which four faculties proceed, after the image of the Tetrad above, and these are called: the first, sight, the second, hearing, the third, smell, and the fourth,(3) taste. And they say that the Ogdoad is indicated by man in this way: that he possesses two ears, the like number of eyes, also two nostrils, and a twofold taste, namely, of bitter and sweet. Moreover, they teach that the whole man contains the entire image of the Triacontad as follows: In his hands, by means of his fingers, he bears the Decad; and in his whole body the Duodecad, inasmuch as his body is divided into twelve members; for they portion that out, as the body of Truth is divided by them--a point of which we have already spoken.(4) But the Ogdoad, as being unspeakable and invisible, is understood as hidden in the viscera.

2. Again, they assert that the sun, the great light-giver, was formed on the fourth day, with a reference to the number of the Tetrad. So also, according to them, the courts(5) of the tabernacle constructed by Moses, being composed of fine linen, and blue, and purple, and scarlet, pointed to the same image. Moreover, they maintain that the long robe of the priest failing over his feet, as being adorned with four rows of precious stones,(6) indicates the Tetrad; and if there are any other things in the Scriptures which can possibly be dragged into the number four, they declare that these had their being with a view to the Tetrad
It would seem the ogdoad was understood to be two tetrads.
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
Secret Alias
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Re: Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

Post by Secret Alias »

Philo's statement that the fourth day is symbolic of the tetrad also should remind us that the tetrad is related to the decad in Pythagorean thought

Image

The Marcosians and Philo connect the Tetragrammaton to the tetrad which Jewish tradition connects to the cube of 12

Image

Two tetrad 72 + 72 = 144
“Finally, from so little sleeping and so much reading, his brain dried up and he went completely out of his mind.”
― Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra, Don Quixote
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Ben C. Smith
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Re: Tertullian, the Rule of Faith and Marcion

Post by Ben C. Smith »

Secret Alias wrote:Philo's statement that the fourth day is symbolic of the tetrad also should remind us that the tetrad is related to the decad in Pythagorean thought

Image

The Marcosians and Philo connect the Tetragrammaton to the tetrad which Jewish tradition connects to the cube of 12

....

Two tetrad 72 + 72 = 144
The cube of 12 is 1728. I believe you mean the square.
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