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The only two Sign Prophets in Josephus who were against the temple of Jerusalem

Posted: Tue May 28, 2024 8:39 pm
by Giuseppe
  • Jesus ben Ananias.
  • The Samaritan Impostor slain by Pilate.

Re: The only two Sign Prophets in Josephus who were against the temple of Jerusalem

Posted: Wed May 29, 2024 1:44 am
by rgprice
Nothing says the Samaritan was against the temple.

Re: The only two Sign Prophets in Josephus who were against the temple of Jerusalem

Posted: Wed May 29, 2024 4:15 am
by Giuseppe
But it is probable, since the new temple on Gerizim excludes that in Jerusalem.

Re: The only two Sign Prophets in Josephus who were against the temple of Jerusalem

Posted: Wed May 29, 2024 3:52 pm
by DCHindley
Not sure that Jesus ben Ananias was against the temple, but was absolutely sure it would come to ruin. I'd hazard a guess that he felt that things were going in the wrong direction, politically, in Judea and especially Jerusalem. Maybe he was crazy as well, but he may have had that off-kilter way of thinking that lent itself to perceiving the forest rather than focusing on individual trees (hot button issues).

I think he hoped, up until the very end, that the human powers that be would come to their senses and make peace with the Romans. Josephus lamented that this had not happened, as the rebel factions had killed most of the high-priestly aristocrats before they could put out feelers.

This wasn't WW2 where the Allies insisted on unconditional surrenders. There were a wide variety of tactics to make conditional agreements, even if blood had been spilled, with the rulers of both parties keeping their jobs, now that they had a chance to size each other up, and were willing to turn away to do other things more important to them (Parthia). On both sides, though, a few sacrificed their lives for the greater good.

I do not think this has to mean that JbA was "anti" temple. He may have wanted a newer, but simpler one, built in its place. That he was able to survive into the final days of the Roman siege suggests that he was himself of aristocratic priestly descent, people who still had control of some resources. The suggests that remains of the elite classes could still act, if the right opportunities presented themselves. Unfortunately, for them, they did not.

In Acts, Stephen gives his little speech outlining Hebrew history to demonstrate that YHWH didn't really need a magnificent temple, but the ark in the tabernacle was all that their God commanded he needed. I think this is a sign that at least some Judeans disapproved of the famously impressive Herodian temple structures. Apparently the Samaritan temple was rather modest.

If we believe the apocryphal gospels, at least one Samaritan traveled to Jerusalem to make sacrifice. I suppose that some Judeans went the other way to Shechem. Israelite factions could have covered a wide variety of practices. Even so, the Judean vs Samaritan antipathy centered on whether Samaritans were "pure" Israelites, and on the legitimacy of the rival priesthoods, both descended from Aaron the brother of Moses.

Hi ho!

DCH
Giuseppe wrote: Tue May 28, 2024 8:39 pm
  • Jesus ben Ananias.
  • The Samaritan Impostor slain by Pilate.

Re: The only two Sign Prophets in Josephus who were against the temple of Jerusalem

Posted: Wed May 29, 2024 7:57 pm
by Giuseppe
A better title reflecting my original thought would be then:

The only two Sign Prophets in Josephus who predicted someway the destruction of Jerusalem and by logical extension of the the temple of Jerusalem.