Biblical Criticism & History Forum - earlywritings.com

But what is important is the fact that Philo found the 'Rises' to be referring to the 'son of God' (no dispute about that since that is what he writes), and so he and/or others of his mindset may have also interpreted the passage as saying that the name of the son of God is Jesus.
It could either be that these kinds of interpretations account in full for the origin of Christianity,

Secret Alias wrote: Why do you keep proselytizing for Carrier when he's been demonstrated to have interpreted the passage in a way that doesn't work? Stop pimping a failed interpretation or at least come up with an answer - or of course shut up.

Bernard Muller wrote:

But what is important is the fact that Philo found the 'Rises' to be referring to the 'son of God' (no dispute about that since that is what he writes), and so he and/or others of his mindset may have also interpreted the passage as saying that the name of the son of God is Jesus.
It could either be that these kinds of interpretations account in full for the origin of Christianity,

This "kinds of interpretations" (as the bolded words) are not evidenced to exist anywhere in the early Christian literature.

Secret Alias wrote: ... Jews understood 'THE messiah' to be royal figure ... The bottom line folks is that when ה֔וֹד is referenced it can't be the high priest ...

Secret Alias wrote: ... the passage was arguing that Zerubbabel was messianic - but in specifically Jewish terms (i.e. as a royal figure, a figure of majesty = hod).

[wiki]Hod_(Kabbalah)[/wiki] (Hebrew הוד howd "majesty, splendour, glory") is the eighth sephiraa of Kabbalistic Tree of Life.

Hod sits below Gevurah and across from Netzach in the tree of life; Yesod is to the south-east of Hod. It has four paths, which lead to Gevurah, Tiphereth, Netzach, and Yesod.

All the sephirot are likened to different parts of the body, and netzach and hod are likened to the two feet of a person: right foot and left foot. Feet are usually only the means for a person's activity.

• a Sephirot (/sfɪˈroʊt/, /ˈsfɪroʊt/; Hebrew: סְפִירוֹת‎ Səphîrôṯ) meaning emanations, are the 10 attributes/emanations in Kabbalah, through which Ein Sof (The Infinite) reveals himself and continuously creates both the physical realm and the chain of higher metaphysical realms (Seder hishtalshelusb). The term is alternatively transliterated into English as Sefirot/Sefiroth, singular Sephirah/Sefirah etc.
  
  Alternative configurations of the sephirot are given by different schools in the historical development of Kabbalah, with each articulating different spiritual aspects ... In Kabbalah the functional structure of the sephirot in channeling Divine creative life force, and revealing the unknowable Divine essence to Creation is described.
  
  The first sephirah describes the Divine Will above intellect. The next sephirot describe conscious Divine Intellect, and the latter sephirot describe the primary and secondary conscious Divine Emotions. Two sephirot (Binah and Malchut) are feminine, as the female principle in Kabbalah describes a vessel that receives the outward male light, then inwardly nurtures and gives birth to lower sephirot. Corresponding to this is the Female Divine Presence (Hebrew: שכינה‎, Shechinah). Kabbalah sees the human soul as mirroring the Divine (after Genesis 1:27, "God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him, male and female He created them"), and more widely, all creations as reflections of their life source in the sephirot. Therefore, the sephirot also describe the spiritual life of man, and constitute the conceptual paradigm in Kabbalah for understanding everything. This relationship between the soul of man and the Divine, gives Kabbalah one of its two central metaphors in describing Divinity, alongside the other Ohr (light) metaphor. However, Kabbalah repeatedly stresses the need to avoid all corporeal interpretation.
  
  
  b In Kabbalistic and Hasidic philosophy, seder hishtalshelus or hishtalshelut (Hebrew: סדר השתלשלות‎) refers to the chain-like descent of spiritual worlds (Olam/Olamot) between God and Creation. Each spiritual world denotes a complete realm of existence, resulting from its general proximity or distance to Divine revelation. Each realm is also a form of consciousness reflected in this world through the psychology of the soul.
  
  The theosophical tradition in Kabbalah is concerned with defining in great detail the esoteric nature, particular divine manifestations, and functional role of each level between the infinite and the finite. Each spiritual realm embodies a creative stage God continually uses to go from his self to the creation of the physical world, the material Universe being the end of the chain, and the only physical realm.

Kabbala #20: Netzach and Hod: Means to an End

The Kabbalah teaches that the questions of Job ("why do the righteous that suffer?") and of King David ("why do the wicked prosper?") find an answer in the attributes of netzach and hod.

... hod refers specifically to those events where the "wicked prosper." It is retribution -- gevurah, "strength/restraint," in essence, but presented by a prelude of pleasantness.

http://www.aish.com/sp/k/Kabbala_20_Net ... n_End.html

Secret Alias wrote:

We aren't talking about whether the passage REALLY WAS MESSIAC or not

But we should because the passage was arguing that Zerubbabel was messianic - but in specifically Jewish terms (i.e. as a royal figure, a figure of majesty = hod). Once we understand that we can move on to how Philo interpreted the passage, but not before that.

TedM wrote: Ok, just saw 3:8. It looks more clear from it that the Branch is NOT Joshua/Jesus. Now that I've seen that, it seems improbable that Philo would have considered the Branch to have been Jesus, son of Josedec or to have been named Jesus based on this information. It is still POSSIBLE that he did so if [he] was unaware of 3:8 and/or the passages he had were worded somewhat ambiguously.

• see two posts up^^ - http://www.earlywritings.com/forum/view ... 537#p42537

Secret Alias wrote:And it has nothing and can have nothing to do with 'Jesus'

Secret Alias wrote:

We aren't talking about whether the passage REALLY WAS MESSIAC or not

But we should, because the passage was arguing that Zerubbabel was messianic - but in specifically Jewish terms (i.e. as a royal figure, a figure of majesty = hod). Once we understand that we can move on to how Philo interpreted the passage, but not before that.

• 
  

  ......Category	.......Sephirah
  . Above-consciousness .	. 1 Keter - "Crown" .
  . Conscious intellect	. 2 Chokhmah - "Wisdom" 3 Binah - "Understanding" .
  . . . Conscious emotions . .	Primary emotions: ..4 Chesed - "Kindness" ..5 Gevurah - "Severity" ..6 Tiferet - "Beauty" .. Secondary emotions: ..7 Netzach - "Eternity" ..8 Hod - "Splendour" ..9 Yesod - "Foundation" .. Vessel to bring action: ..10 Malkuth - "Kingship" .

  
  from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sephirot#Listings