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About same pronunciation in ancient Hebrew: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7RIAPosxEI starting at 5:40 (it's pronounced either as k or kh)That's modern Hebrew.
This is passing the buck to internet pundits who won't answer how they know how ancient speakers pronounced the sounds. I can demonstrate how the sounds were perceived from Greek transliterations.Bernard Muller wrote:to spin,About same pronunciation in ancient Hebrew: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7RIAPosxEI starting at 5:40 (it's pronounced either as k or kh)That's modern Hebrew.
Actually that is not what the person said. He said they'd say it as a "ch" as in "loch" or he also notes as "k-h" (run together) in an effort to give people not familiar with the language something to work with. He does not say that it like a simple "k", but with a little extra guttural into it. The speaker is not a paragon of phonology, given his pronunciation of "loch" as an American would say the "o" not as a Scot would, and given his pronunciation of the German "ich" with a long vowel. He's got the "ch" though. The extra that he is putting into the chi is what separates it from the kappa and why the Greek transliterators chose the Qof to be rendered as a kappa and usually not the Kaf.Bernard Muller wrote:to spin,
According to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qShHCreWbdM starting at 13:38, the ancient Greek letter chi has a "k" sound (with others!) in it.
Conjecture based on Wiktionary and the like is not useful. The subject is how Semitic sounds (Kap and Qof) were perceived by outsiders and specifically by Greeks.Bernard Muller wrote:Looking at https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%CF%87%C ... ient_Greek, it looks that for certain Greek words starting with a chi (X), the transition from a "k" sound to a "ch" sound took many centuries.
When the LXX was first written (3rd to 1st cent. BCE), it seems the chi could have had still a significant "k" sound in it.
And for the Aramaic/Syriac kap, it appears the pronunciation was either a "k" or a "ch", depending of the word (and maybe there was a transition from "k" to "ch" during antiquity): http://www.learnassyrian.com/aramaic/
Cordially, Bernard
In Paul's day, how rare was the Greek name Peter (Πέτρος)?"Cephas" & "Peter" were very rare names in those days.
I have done no research on this of my own, but Ehrman writes on page 16 of Peter, Paul, and Mary:robert j wrote:In Paul's day, how rare was the Greek name Peter (Πέτρος)?"Cephas" & "Peter" were very rare names in those days.
Thanks Ben.Ben C. Smith wrote:I have done no research on this of my own, but Ehrman writes on page 16 of Peter, Paul, and Mary:robert j wrote:In Paul's day, how rare was the Greek name Peter (Πέτρος)?
It was an auspicious moment in the history of names. Even though rock (Peter) was just a noun before this, it became a popular name in the early Christian period, on down, of course, until today.