Why Richard Carrier is 100% right about the extreme diffusion of euhemerization: the curious case of Epiphanes

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Giuseppe
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Why Richard Carrier is 100% right about the extreme diffusion of euhemerization: the curious case of Epiphanes

Post by Giuseppe »

Not only Richard Carrier is basically right when he insists that the people from Antiquity indulge again and again in euhemerization of deities, very all the time. Also Roger Parvus is right when he observes that the Gnostics co-opted a lot of deities of other religions (included Judaism) in their strange system and mythology. Only read the part in bold:


Carpocrate.

Carpocrate paraît avoir professé une doctrine très proche de celle de Basilide. [13] Il était parlé dans sa théologie d'un «Père inengendré», de «Puissances» placées au-dessous de lui et d'«Anges» inférieurs dont certains firent le monde et assujettirent les hommes à leurs lois capricieuses. A ses yeux Jésus était un homme pareil aux autres, mais comme il avait une âme ferme et pure, qui gardait le souvenir de sa haute origine, Dieu lui envoya une de ses Puissances qui lui permit de se libérer et de remonter jusqu'à son premier Principe. Ainsi feront les âmes qui lui ressembleront. Mais il leur faut pour cela s'affranchir comme lui de toutes les lois humaines, car elles ne sont que des institutions arbitraires auxquelles les Maîtres du ciel ont eu recours pour nous tenir en esclavage. Ici tous les commentateurs s'indignent et crient au scandale. A les en croire, Carpocrate aurait invité ses adeptes à violer toutes les prescriptions, à commettre tous les crimes. Il est clair pourtant que du moment où l'on regarde avec lui toutes les lois humaines comme arbitraires, on n'est pas plus tenu à les enfreindre qu'à les observer. Pour lui comme pour tous les gnostiques la vraie règle de vie est la gnose du salut, qui ne vient pas des mauvais anges mais de Dieu lui-même, et qui demande à chacun de se dégager des liens de la chair pour vivre selon l'esprit. Aussi prêche-t-il l'imitation de Jésus dont l'âme resta toujours «ferme et pure».

On raconte que Carpocrate eut d'une femme appelée Alexandrie, un fils du nom d'Epiphanie, d'une précocité stupéfiante, auteur d'un important traité «sur la justice», qui mourut à dix-sept ans et fut honoré comme un dieu dans sa patrie. Tous ces détails paraissent bien étranges. Alexandrie est avant tout un nom de lieu, celui de la ville qui fut comme la mère d'«Epiphane», dieu «qui se manifeste» aux humains. «Carpocrate» ressemble singulièrement à «Harpocrate», par lequel on désignait couramment Horus, le fils d'Isis et d'Osiris, représenté d'ordinaire sous les traits d'un enfant. Le culte du jeune Epiphane ne serait-il pas tout simplement celui d'une manifestation d'Horus, qu'une secte gnostique aurait adopté en l'interprétant dans un sens chrétien, en invoquant un écrit théologique mis au compte du Dieu? Un tel syncrétisme est dans l'ordre des vraisemblances, car nous en trouvons d'autres exemples typiques au sein du même groupe. En effet, il nous est dit que les Carpocratiens ont des images peintes ou sculptées de Pythagore, de Platon, d'Aristote et d'autres sages, ainsi qu'une oeuvre analogue de Pilate représentant Jésus. On ajoute qu'ils exposent ces images, et pratiquent à leur égard les mêmes observances que les nationaux.
[14]

Ce dernier détail suppose un culte assez complexe. A cela s'ajoute la mention de repas sacrés ou agapes auxquels participaient hommes et femmes. Après avoir bien mangé et bien bu, nous dit-on, ils éteignaient les lumières et se livraient à toutes sortes de désordres. [15] Mais les mêmes bruits couraient sur l'ensemble des Chrétiens. Rien ne prouve qu'ils aient été plus fondés en un cas que dans l'autre. Peut-être els Carpocratiens s'y prêtaient-ils davantage par le mystère plus grand dont ils s'entouraient ou par l'union plus étroite qui s'affirmait entre eux. Ils disaient en effet que Jésus avait recommandé à ses apôtres et à ses disciples de ne faire part de ses révélations qu'à ceux qui en seraient dignes. Ils formaient en conséquence une société secrète où on vivait sous le double signe de la foi et de l'amour. Les purs se distinguaient entre eux par une marque peu apparente, une brûlure dans la partie postérieure de la saillie de l'oreille gauche. C'était pour eux le stigmate du Christ.

(Prosper Alfaric, Origines Sociales du Christianisme, p. 207-208, my bold)
andrewcriddle
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Re: Why Richard Carrier is 100% right about the extreme diffusion of euhemerization: the curious case of Epiphanes

Post by andrewcriddle »

I am convinced that Epiphanes author of On Justice was a real person. His relation to the Epiphanes, supposedly begotten of Carpocrates/Harpocrates and Alexandria, and worshipped as a God is unclear, as is the relation of either to the Gnostics known as Carpocratians.

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Giuseppe
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Re: Why Richard Carrier is 100% right about the extreme diffusion of euhemerization: the curious case of Epiphanes

Post by Giuseppe »

Once the suspicion is raised (that Epiphanes is a historicized version of Horus), I wonder how one may overcome the simple agnostic position about his real existence. Is there a way?

Alfaric argues that also Simon of Samaria was a historicized version of Esmoun, a Phoenician deity. So a pattern may be detected here, given the Gnostic inclination to co-opt Pagan deities in their mythology.

ADDENDA:
Prosper ALFARIC (A.2: Alfaric, 1921) argued for the importance for a knowledge of Simonianism of a brief description of seventeen heresies coming from the pen of Marutha (aliter Marutas, Marouta) bishop of Maipherqat (aliter Martyropolis;today called Mefarkin or Silvan and located in Turkey), who died c. 419» in which reference was made to the Simonian 'Book of the Four Corners, or Four Regions, of the World'. This lost book Alfaric believed to be the work of Simon, and to have been one of the sources used by the Pseudo-Clementines, the Conflict Narratives and the apocryphal Acts. Simon was a 'Samaritan Christ' who founded what he intended to be a world religion. In a note appended to his article when it was reprinted in 1955, (A.2: Alfaric, 1955), Alfaric identified Simon with the deity Esmoun and suggested that the apostle Peter was not really called Simon (he was given the name as part of an anti-Simonian apologia!) and that the canonical Acts was written c. 150 by Clement of Rome, who for 8. 4-25 drew on the text of Justin. Alfaric returned to the subject of Simonianism in a book which appeared in the following year (A.2: Alfaric, 1956). Simon had now become a purely mythical figure, an avatar of Esmoun. Alfaric now posited a considerable influence of Simonianism, a pre-Christian religion with its headquarters at Antioch, on Christianity, in particular on Paul.

http://etheses.dur.ac.uk/9764/1/9764_6558.PDF
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Re: Why Richard Carrier is 100% right about the extreme diffusion of euhemerization: the curious case of Epiphanes

Post by MrMacSon »

andrewcriddle wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:13 am I am convinced that Epiphanes author of On Justice was a real person. His relation to the Epiphanes, supposedly begotten of Carpocrates/Harpocrates and Alexandria, and worshipped as a God is unclear, as is the relation of either to the Gnostics known as Carpocratians.
David Litwa says in Found Christianities they're all one and the same ie. Epiphanes who wrote On Justice was the precocious son of Carpocrates who died young and was deified. Litwa notes in a footnote, #10, p.125, "Our most reliable source for Carprocates, Epiphanes, and Marcella are Clement,* who provides the sole fragment of a Carpocratian (Epiphanes), and Ireneus^ ... The evidence of Clement's letter to Theodore reputedly discovered by Morton Smith in 1958 must be bracketed due to reasonable suspicions of forgery."

* fn. #11 Strom 3.2.6.1 - 3.2.9.3

^ A.H. 1.25, I believe
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MrMacSon
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Re: Why Richard Carrier is 100% right about the extreme diffusion of euhemerization: the curious case of Epiphanes

Post by MrMacSon »

fwiw, in English

Carpocrates seems to have professed a doctrine very close to that of Basilides.[13] He was spoken in his theology of an "unbegotten Father," of "Powers" placed below him, and of inferior "Angels," some of whom made the world and subjected men to their laws. capricious. In his eyes Jesus was a man like the others, but as he had a firm and pure soul, which kept the memory of his high origin, God sent him one of his Powers that allowed him to free himself and go back to his first Principle. Thus will make the souls who will resemble him. But for this they must free themselves like him from all human laws, because they are only arbitrary institutions that the Masters of heaven have resorted to for us. hold in slavery. Here all the commentators are indignant and cry scandal. According to them, Carpocrates would have invited his followers to violate all the prescriptions, to commit all the crimes. It is clear, however, that as long as one looks with him at all human laws as arbitrary, one is no more bound to violate them than to observe them. For him as for all Gnostics the true rule of life is the gnosis of salvation, which does not come from the evil angels but from God himself, and which asks everyone to free themselves from the bonds of the flesh to live according to the spirit. So he preached the imitation of Jesus whose soul always remained "firm and pure".

It is said that Carpocrates had from a woman called Alexandria, a son named Epiphany, of astonishing precocity, author of an important treatise "On Justice", who died at the age of seventeen and was honored as a god in his homeland. All these details seem very strange. Alexandria is above all a place name, that of the city that was like the mother of "Epiphanius", god "who manifests himself" to humans. "Carpocrat" is singularly similar to "Harpocrat", by which Horus, the son of Isis and Osiris, was commonly referred to as a child. Wouldn't the cult of the young Epiphanius simply be that of a manifestation of Horus, which a Gnostic sect would have adopted by interpreting it in a Christian sense, in invoking a theological writing attributed to the God? Such syncretism is in the order of likelihood, as we find other typical examples within the same group. Indeed, we are told that the Carpocratians have painted or carved images of Pythagoras, Plato, Aristotle and other sages, as well as a similar work of Pilate representing Jesus. It is added that they exhibit these images, and practice towards them the same observances as the nationals. [14]

This last detail supposes a rather complex cult. To this is added the mention of sacred meals or agapes in which men and women participated. After eating well and drinking well, we are told, they turned off the lights and indulged in all kinds of disorders.[15] But the same noises were running over all Christians. There is no evidence that they were more well-founded in one case than in the other. Perhaps the Carpocratians lent themselves more to it by the greater mystery with which they surrounded themselves or by the closer union that asserted itself between them. They said that Jesus had advised his apostles and disciples to share his revelations only with those who would be worthy of them. As a result, they formed a secret society where one lived under the double sign of faith and love. The pure ones were distinguished among themselves by an inconspicuous mark, a burn in the posterior part of the protrusion of the left ear. It was for them the stigma of Christ.

(Prosper Alfaric, Origines Sociales du Christianisme, pp. 207-208)


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Re: Why Richard Carrier is 100% right about the extreme diffusion of euhemerization: the curious case of Epiphanes

Post by andrewcriddle »

MrMacSon wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 2:10 pm
andrewcriddle wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:13 am I am convinced that Epiphanes author of On Justice was a real person. His relation to the Epiphanes, supposedly begotten of Carpocrates/Harpocrates and Alexandria, and worshipped as a God is unclear, as is the relation of either to the Gnostics known as Carpocratians.
David Litwa says in Found Christianities they're all one and the same ie. Epiphanes who wrote On Justice was the precocious son of Carpocrates who died young and was deified. Litwa notes in a footnote, #10, p.125, "Our most reliable source for Carprocates, Epiphanes, and Marcella are Clement,* who provides the sole fragment of a Carpocratian (Epiphanes), and Ireneus^ ... The evidence of Clement's letter to Theodore reputedly discovered by Morton Smith in 1958 must be bracketed due to reasonable suspicions of forgery."

* fn. #11 Strom 3.2.6.1 - 3.2.9.3

^ A.H. 1.25, I believe
The Epiphanes worshipped as a God with rituals linked to the moon supposedly died age seventeen. Seventeen is the maximum possible days from new moon to full moon (or from full moon to new moon). This may be suspicious. See e.g. Epiphanes

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Re: Why Richard Carrier is 100% right about the extreme diffusion of euhemerization: the curious case of Epiphanes

Post by schillingklaus »

GRS Mead described already in Fragments of a Faith Forgotten that Epiphanes is an Euhemerization of the reapperaring moon.
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